| George Zimmerman not guilty | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 14 2013, 03:28 AM (1,105 Views) | |
| Noir | Jul 14 2013, 12:43 PM Post #11 |
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Bitch, please!
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as you described the act, it was 100% homicide. only question should be was it involuntary or on purpose! best part of us jurisdiction, you pull a gun and kill a guy and nobody, i repeat NOBODY!!!, says your guilty because its not proven that you wanted to kill that afro... normally if i pull a gun what do i do? right shooting, mostly in the biggest part of the body, because the gun owner is a fucking noob and has absolutely no shooting skills. shooting someone in the brest / upper body causes death in 80% of the time. people who are allowed to own a gun should be aware of that and also should be obligated to have shooting lessons so they can fire guns at smaller parts of the body than the upper body. a shot to a leg would have helped that zimmerman guy aswell, the other would have been immobilized and wouldnt die for sure edith: ... i think the right english word is "manslaughter" because homicide is used for both murder and manslaughter. e2: zimmerman calls the police because in his opinion martin is suspicious, zimmerman is known for setting of wrong alert several times. quote"a really suspicious guy whos up to someting, who took drugs or something" <- this; because martin walked during dizzling rain with a hoody on? i could be dead 100 times.... after reading 5 news articles about that story im pretty sure zimmerman is guilty for manslaughter, probably involuntary because from the news you cant prove him a racistic reason! the only reason why he gets away with it is because of those stupid gun/ weapon laws the USA has. STAND YOUR GROUND!!!1 Zimmerman should be happy that he lives in the states and not in europe + if i were him i would get out of florida into a state with stricter weapon laws, wouldnt mind a afro killing him during his neighborhood patrol because he looks suspicious in his car driving around, checking houses... probably a robber checking houses he wants to break in soon! Edited by Noir, Jul 14 2013, 01:50 PM.
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| NYKnicks | Jul 14 2013, 02:49 PM Post #12 |
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i'm no fag
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The way i described it, which was unbiased, it was 100% self defense. Everything i explained happened, but like i said the iffy part is part when there is a confrontation between the two. The question isn't whether or not he killed him, Zimmerman admits to killing him, it whether or not it was what he was being charged with(second degree murder) or self defense. And your point saying that Zimmerman could have shot his leg or arm isn't realistic. If he was getting the shit beat out of him he would just point and shoot. Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman when he was shot, so there is certainly no aiming in that situation. In some states, when you purchase a gun you are required to have shooting lessons. You are taught to shoot the torso, not limbs or the head. Your explanation of how and where to fire a gun is just wrong. I know it's not the popular opinion amongst most, especially amongst non-Americans, but I'm pro gun. No normal person shoots innocent people. It is absolutely the person that kills and not the gun. but that's neither here nor there.... Edited by NYKnicks, Jul 14 2013, 02:54 PM.
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| some | Jul 14 2013, 03:44 PM Post #13 |
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Going to take this off topic a little bit, but US gun laws are retarded, selling concealable weapons and semiauto and full auto weapons to almost everyone is just plain dumb. Your constitution (that piece of paper which says people have to bear arms) was written for people living in a different time when access to such weapons was limited, and carried into todays times it gives anyone the right to have powerful, modern weapons and to carry them. Like sure they might do some type of screening to distinguish between who is fit to have guns, but situations, attitudes and life circumstances change, not to mention other people using a family members or friends gun. Here gun laws are strict, it's a privilege (not a right) to have one, and here were not allowed to have concealable weapons (pistols) or any semi/full auto weapon. We're allowed bolt action rifles and pump action shot guns so that we don't hose down schools, malls and stuff, if we even manage to get one shot off we have to reload (unlikely because carrying a rifle or a shotgun into a public place is likely to raise some suspicion), and we need to submit to random police requests at any time to prove the guns are locked and safe, that we don't have more than a certain amount of ammunition as well as a check up in terms of mental health and family situations, who would have access to the gun safe etcetc. I hunt from time to time, and am subject to these checks annoyingly often, but I appreciate the idea behind them wanting to check. Edited by some, Jul 14 2013, 03:46 PM.
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| NYKnicks | Jul 14 2013, 09:18 PM Post #14 |
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i'm no fag
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Well, you're right. They shouldn't let just anyone have a gun. In some states the background check is fucking retarded. It is literally I wanna buy a gun Okay sign here Thanks In other countries, like I think North Carolina has a huge background check and a shooting class. Most gun murders, specifically the mass murders, are commuted with an unregistered weapon, meaning that the murderer had that gun illegally, meaning that the murderer would have been able to kill people with a gun regardless if it was legal or not. Purchasing fully automatic weapons is extraordinarily expensive and hard to do. Whatever the process is for a pistol is multiplied by 10 for a fully auto. To get off topic for a sec, you saw bolt action rifles and pump action shotguns are allowed where you live. A pump action shotgun is incredibley powerful, depending on the shell capacity does not required to be reloaded that often. The pump takes less than a second. Same with a bolt action. You say you've gone hunting so you'd know this, semi automatic and bolt action rifles are much, much more deadly than fully automatic rifles. Of course there are exceptions, but semi and bolt often use a high caliber round, and firing that is a lot more powerful and 16383826x more accurate than firing a fully auto. It not how it is in the movies, you can't just hold down the trigger and send 30 rounds into the same hole. But back to gun laws, the problem still Isn't the gun. We're not seeing more and more powerful guns being used in this shootings, we're seeing crazier and crazier people. The weapon is irrelevant. The biggest mass murder ever was in a country(I can't remember which) that had some of the strictest gun laws ever. On the same day as the Sandy Hook school shooting, some guy killed 22 people in china with a knife. On the planes on 9/11 the planes were held up with box cutters. Now I'm not for this, cause it would certainly bring something bad, but you were allowed to carry on a plane, it would have never happened. Guns should be a weapon first used for sport, hunting, idk target shooting, and second be used for self defense. |
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| some | Jul 14 2013, 11:03 PM Post #15 |
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Replacing the round on a bolt action rifle for me takes way more than a second, which is enough to disarm someone using one, I think. They're a lot more powerful, but you still only get one shot. With semi and full auto rifles, sure theres recoil and whatever else, but it's still possible to take out anyone coming at you, and to kill groups of people. Never used on ever, but I think so anyway. While the size of the round is relevant to how lethal it is, it's has a lot more to do with ease of use, a lot of the US shootings have been done with semi/full auto weapons because of this. Nobody carries a bolt action rifle into a movie theatre or whatever, they'd use something that is more dangerous to groups. Pump action shotguns I agree with you on, but the idea of anyone carrying one into any public venue is just insanity here. And yeah, guns don't kill people, people kill people. Completely agree, but guns facilitate it and make it easier for weak people to do these kind of shootings. Like I think every country has it's fair share of idiots, and there have been massacres in Australia but these happen once in 20 years. We still have violent crimes, they're mostly just beatings tho. It seems a bit crazy for US government to allow a group of people the right to bear arms, when it's getting increasingly common for people to be depressed, crazy, violent etc (People are more prone to mental problems nowadays for some reason, or it's more reported that they are anyway) in todays times just because a piece of paper written a hundred years ago tells them to. Edited by some, Jul 14 2013, 11:07 PM.
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| NYKnicks | Jul 15 2013, 01:08 AM Post #16 |
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i'm no fag
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Yeah, the one second thing isn't as true with a bolt action weapon as it is with a pump action. In terms of lethality being related to the ease of use, semi autos are farrrr more accurate and easy to use than a fully auto. But anyway, I think there is a problem, but I'm not sure how to fix it. Luckily I don't have too :))))))))))))))))) |
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| Shinta | Jul 15 2013, 09:20 AM Post #17 |
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He killed a nigger, he is not guilty. Since when cleaning the world is prohibited
Edited by Shinta, Jul 15 2013, 09:20 AM.
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| Noir | Jul 15 2013, 11:09 AM Post #18 |
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Bitch, please!
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Sorry for getting back to topic, on one hand because i think that a discussion about which weapon is more dangerous and which are less is simply stupid. like brian said its not the weapon that murder its simply the tool for the murderer, but the weapon actually does the kill ![]() on the other hand i cant stand the fact that brian/ maybe even that tard of judge in that zimmerman case can call a shot down of a civil person of the usa by another CIVIL person of the usa self defence.... where in hell people believe something retarded as USING A FUCKING WEAPON COULD BE SELF DEFENCE!? a gun can never be a tool for self defence, the natur of a gun is always aggression not defence! self defence "weapons" are electroshocker, pepperspray, a kick in the balls, martial arts ... heck even going away and staying of scene is self defence. Zimmerman IGNORED an advice by an authorised person he didnt had to follow, but it is a proposal for acting in the best way in such situation. so first he ignored the advice, his first aggressiv movement towards martin. he followed that guy... who is not getting pissed if some retards driving behind you and checking whatya doing and later talking shit about you!? then he is confronting the victim; nobody knows what he said, but the fact that he confronted a person, whom he has nothing to tell/ command/ forbid/ order to (just for your brains to remember, in the beginning zimmerman ignored the advice of the 911 guy) shows the direction zimmerman wants this to go - CONFRONTATION! as long as somebody confronts another person on his own will, talking about self defence with a gun is imo impossible. Zimmerman acted on purpose against the advice of the 911 callcenter duudle, confronted a person heself proclaimed to be a "suspicious person who is up to do something bad" or took drugs (which means could act irrational). this shows nothing what can give a RATIONAL reasoning for zimmerman using a gun for SELF DEFENCE. i guess i repeat myself, but the only reason zimmerman got away with murder was because of those really stupid gun law "stand your ground" |
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| NYKnicks | Jul 15 2013, 01:21 PM Post #19 |
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i'm no fag
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First of all, it's impossible to debate with someone who is an extremist on a side of anything. To say that you can never use a gun as self defense is just plain retarded. Your opinion on guns is so one sided that your opinion can't be taken seriously. Second, the OBVIOUS call for the jury to make is not guilty. Not only is Zimmerman the only witness, but his story matches up perfectly with the little evidence there was(broken nose in Zimmerman, cuts on the back of his head which was being slammed on the ground, Trayvon being shot while he was on top of Zimmerman). He also passed a lie detector test which is nearly impossible to voluntarily do. Even is Zimmerman is actually in the wrong here, there isn't enough evidence to call him guilty anyway. In fact, Zimmerman, after the shooting, was released virtually immediately. Only because of the media was he charged with murder SIX WEEKS AFTER. Any rational person would think Trayvon is suspicious for hopping a fence into the neighborhood. Zimmerman has a black grandfather, he's had black girlfriends, he is friendly with his black neighbors. It's not a race issue. He was 100% right to call the police on Trayvon, and even if it wasn't the RIGHT MOVE to follow Trayvon, it's not illegal. And do you actually think that Zimmerman, who is an out of shape 5'7 guy would start a fight with a 6'1 tall athletic black guy ? Trayvon likely noticed that Zimmerman was following him, and when Trayvon saw how much of a physical advantage over Zimmerman he had when Zimmerman got out of his car, Trayvon started a fight. What's more likely ? Absolutely traditional, out of shape, tiny guy confronts a larger athletic guy and starts a fight Bigger guy, with a history of violence, confronts guy when he realizes he is physically superior. Get the gun thing that you're obsessed with out of the equation for a moment and pretend Zimmerman killed him with a knife instead. Focus on the actual confrontation instead of the gun part, because there is no argument whether or not guns should be used for self defense, but you're getting to wrapped up on that. Anyway, my final thought on the situation is this. Zimmerman should have stayed in his car, but he didn't have to. He should lose his neighborhood watch position for following Trayvon, but he shouldn't be charged with second degree murder, or manslaughter. Trayvon didn't deserve to die, Zimmerman doesn't deserve to be convicted. Edited by NYKnicks, Jul 15 2013, 01:34 PM.
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| Noir | Jul 15 2013, 04:44 PM Post #20 |
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Bitch, please!
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first off all you missunderstood one point of mine. i do not disagree with the fact that zimmerman was in the end a victim of martin who kicked his ass out of his body, but .... Zimmermans reaction was, on purpose or not, a delict called "negligent homicide" (18 USC ยง 1112 - Manslaughter A) "Manslaughter is the unlawful killing of a human being without malice. It is of two kinds:" Involuntary - "[...]or without due caution and circumspection, of a lawful act which might produce death. ") explanation? the lawful act was the act of "self defence"!! In the end it doesnt matter if Zimmerman used a fucking gun, a knife, a pensil or his penis!!! i dont give a shit what his weapon used in crime was and i also dont give a shit about Martins fucking skincolor.* Thats for the part why i say Zimmerman is definitly NOT not guilty! About the reasoning why Zimmerman was released virtually immediatly after the delict, 1.) a huge mistage by local police (as said in the newspaper the chief inspector stepped down from his position) 2.) only made because of the so called "stand your ground" law of the state Florida, by which Zimmerman defended himself against Martin Oh and about ... And do you actually think that Zimmerman, who is an out of shape 5'7 guy would start a fight with a 6'1 tall athletic black guy ? Trayvon likely noticed that Zimmerman was following him, and when Trayvon saw how much of a physical advantage over Zimmerman he had when Zimmerman got out of his car, Trayvon started a fight. Yes, i do think Zimmerman got the balls to confront Martin. You like to know why, because im in your eyes a fucking extremist and think Zimmerman only got the balls to get out of the car because he knew he has a gun in the backhand. without the gun he would never get out of the car, maybe with a knife aswell, but without any real weapon? NEVER! Maybe you should ask yourself why did he anyway get out of his car?! - Cars nowadays have autolog (nobody gets in if the doors not open from the inside) - if Martin tries to destroy a window, Zimmerman can drive out of range (a 17 years old punk CANNOT stop a driving car, superman could but not Martin) - keeping Martin on the street till the already called police arrives but risking damage on the car - a damaged car is pro zimmerman at that point Only reason i can see is the confrontation with Martin before the cops arrive!!! funny things in the end; Zimmerman might left the car because Martin, after being followed by Zimmerman with a car, jumped over a fence and tried to run away. a question for you? did you ever do drugs? or do you have a friend who did drugs in the past? or do you know what a typical reaction for a lot of people on drugs is? right, freaking paranoia and irrational thinking! Now imagine, you took a bunch of pills some hours ago, because of that you went from a friends house to some store to get skittles and some icetea/cream w.e., your friend stood at home stoned, it rains.. some wierdo is following you, youre noticing it because that noob is ... a total noob. his car still has the lights on and youre permanently in the lightsight. or no better, that guy following you is a super smart ass and takes his lights off. he thinks you didnt notice but you did because still, one car - no lights on, obviously following you. Remember youre still on drugs. Fucking paranoia hits you like some baseballplayer hits the ball. Oh did i mention youre a kurd in a turkiye city? sorry for that, background check? no prob at all, you got in fights several times in your life before because youre a kurd in fucking turkey. turks dont like kurds! or wait better, youre a fucking negro in a southern state, KKK is knocking on your door daily, racism aint a word from history class. for YOU its reality. Now you are definitly scarred as shit, some random niggerhater follows you maybe he wants to fucking kill you? /Paranoia you take youre knees to your hands and pay a lot of land to get out of the street. throught the gardens, its a short cut back to your friends house and even if you go somewhere wrong you still get rid of that niggerhater in the car. no trouble is better than trouble! oh look, the kkk fucker got outta his car, probably wants to stop you from running away, but that noob is a retard. you recognized that he is definitly in physical disadvantage - revange time even i tried to make it look funny, i dont think that it is funny at all. that story i posted above can be what happend in martins thoughts that night he died. sadly nobody will find out because he was shot down. now jumping back to Zimmerman: he called the police some minutes ago, informing them that some "suspicious person" whos up to some trouble or "is on drugs" (those quotes were recorded during Zimmermans call with the police, i did a bad quoting because i had a translated text, i am sorry for that!) is sneaking around his neighborhood, he followed him even the 911 callcenter duudle told him NOT to do so. thats the point we are back at my last post. now martin runs away, jumping over a fence, because zimmerman cant follow with a car over a fence he gets out of the car simply because he wants to stop the person he suspects to be the burglar who lately steals shit in his neighborhood. a little stop from how it could have been. ( i know so far this is how i think it could have happend. i wasnt there - but this is how i as, a juror, would have a look at the case) i hope you see, Zimmerman watched Martin the last view minutes of Martins life. he saw how athletic martin was and that he would definitly be no opponent for martin if it starts to get out of his hands and a physical conflict between those two begins. NOW the weapon steps in!!! Zimmerman knows he is in disadvantage but still has the weapon in his backhand, if everything is getting out of control, pulling the weapon should stop martin from physical actions towards Zimmerman, at least thats what Zimmerman thinks. the weapon itself gave Zimmerman the feeling of still being boss in the situation, while his nature instinct should have said "stop it you will get wiped your ass off". the weapon outbalances the nature instinct of a human being. the weapon itself is like a drug, pretending to radiate safety for its wearer. Because of that pretended safety Zimmerman got from his weapon he made the mistake to follow martin which ended how it ended. in my eyes martin wouldnt died if there was no weapon in the beginning, because at that point zimmerman never had the balls to disobey the advice of the 911 callcenter dude and handle things on his own - if he still would follow martin, he would be stupid and probably died. in that case martin would be the one who should be puniched for negligent homicide! (a bit off topic; you know the wild west?! people there used the carry guns for self defence aswell. do you know who normally won duels? the one who used the weapon for self defence or the one who shot first to defend himself against the so called aggressior? now, who started the cold war? the one who got the first nuks or the one who got nuks because he felt unsafe having no nuks while the other guy has nuks? thats the part why i am an extremist against weapons! my point is if there are no legal weapons for the civil people (guns, piercing weapons) but only for the police, are we really UNSAFER? i dont think so. thats the only point where i am extrem.) *i dont even see a reason why you came up with that racism shit, shinta said some rasistic stuff, i didnt mention it at all, because i also think it was no rasistic murder but a goddamn negligent homicide. (there was/ is only an option that zimmerman had a rasistic intention, which i suspected in a post before but cant prove -> he is not guilty for rasistic murder for me at this point of information) ______ in the end longer than i wanted to do, but i think i explained very detailed why i do think Zimmerman is guilty for negligent homicide! the worst thing about this all is that the federal prosecutor tried to make an example on Zimmerman and went for a delict he never could prove to be done by Zimmerman "murder with racial intention", if she went slow with a realistic prosecution she would have go with the above named delict. + in every single nation of europe Zimmerman would be arrested for the delict listed in the beginning of this post tl;dr Zimmerman felt safe because of gun - it ended how it ended us judiciary fails!! edited some mistakes and added "legal" (its /B) Edited by Noir, Jul 15 2013, 05:55 PM.
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8:50 AM Jul 11