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Bricks and Dragons is having its first meeting on Saturday, February 5th, 2011. See the event details in the forum topic (link) or on Facebook (link). | |||
"It was as if a million possible hijinks cried out, and were suddenly silenced by plot."
(Phrixscreoth)
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| Censorship in Music (a.k.a. Money for nothing...); WTF?!?!? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Friday Jan 14 2011, 01:19 AM (604 Views) | |
| Xamad | Friday Jan 14 2011, 01:19 AM Post #1 |
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This annoys me to no end... WTFNEWShttp://ca.news.yahoo.com/dire-straits-money-nothing-censored-broadcast-panel-rules-20110112-175448-551.html How about the hundreds of songs out there that are discriminatory to females/asians/blacks/whites/police officers/americans/south asians/ (the list goes on)?!?! Should CBSC ban those as well? Like seriously wtf? Its been around for like 25 years and it was banned on Wednesday?!!?!?!?!?! THAT IS SO AGGRAVATING! *CENSORSHIP* well I never *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* would shove it so far *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* with a melon *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* chainsaw *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* jump *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* crush your *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* with a *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* sledgehammer *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* bucket *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* *CENSORSHIP* AND THEN I'D REALLY *CENSORSHIP* YOU UP!!!!! In short: Is pissed at what censorship has become Hopes: That this will blow up because most of the baby boomers are alive and well enough to do something stupid Is happy: As Dire Straits will still be making money for nothing as their song has got free advertising EDIT by Lexanimus: Please give your topics descriptive and informative titles, especially in a debate forum. Thank you. Edited by Lexanimus, Saturday Jan 15 2011, 03:08 PM.
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| Isura | Friday Jan 14 2011, 07:38 PM Post #2 |
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It's almost like the broadcasting company is trying to edit the content that they deem allowable to play so that it doesn't discriminate. As for the time of the ban, 25 years ago people were campaigning to have freedom from discrimination based on sexual orientation passed as a law. Removing hate speech from government sponsored organizations seems reasonable to me. I don't see how removing a song that contains the word 'faggot' until an edit has been made is seen as overwhelming, unreasonable censorship. Also, what was censorship before? |
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| onegirlarmy | Saturday Jan 15 2011, 12:14 AM Post #3 |
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I'm V and I like girls. A lot.
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Yeah, I'm actually okay with censoring homophobic lyrics, just as I am with censoring any opressive lyrics from publicly broadcasted venues. Your right to say whatever you want only goes as far as my right not to be discriminated against or subjected to hate speech. |
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La la love you don't mean maybe! | |
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| onegirlarmy | Saturday Jan 15 2011, 12:15 AM Post #4 |
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I'm V and I like girls. A lot.
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Also, when did censorship change in either definition or in action? To the best of my understanding, it's not really changed. :/ |
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La la love you don't mean maybe! | |
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| Xamad | Saturday Jan 15 2011, 01:23 PM Post #5 |
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Thank you for posting! I littered my first post with fallacies (3 I think) hoping that some one would call me on them and there for spark a discussion about censorship (feel free to spot and point them out!) This is less about homophobia (which I will also get to so keep reading) and more about what gets censored and who gets to decide. We see/listen to songs,TV ads, and magazine articles that objectify women on a daily basis yet it is not censored. However when 1 man complains about 1 song lyric it is censored within a year. The lyric from the song is, and I quote, "See the little faggot with the earring and the makeup Yeah buddy that's his own hair That little faggot got his own jet airplane That little faggot he's a millionaire". I don't see this as discrimination and more see it as the reinforcement of the stereotype (positive?) that gay people are rich. ***If you were unsure of why I questioned if the stereotype was positive I will try and explain my reasoning. I see that lyric on the same level as "All Asians are smart". Is that statement discriminatory (the unjust or prejudicial treatment of different categories of people or things, esp. on the grounds of race, age, or sex)? However no one says anything to stop that stereotype as being smart is seen as a positive attribute in Western society. The Dire Strait's lyric it is promoting the stereotype that "Gay people are rich" and as being rich is also seen as a positive attribute in Western society I question if is is a positive stereotype. I hope that we can continue this discussion! |
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| Lexanimus | Saturday Jan 15 2011, 02:59 PM Post #6 |
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Fra fra fra fra fra~
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We have the right to free speech, but we also have the right to not be discriminated against for things like sex, gender, race, ethnicity, sexuality, etc. It's okay for you to say what you want, as long as I don't have to hear it. Make sense? I agree with what onegirlarmy said about this. So no, there should not be any governing body that censors stuff. That's unnecessary and could have drastic repercussions. Should music publishers be selective in the music they publish? Yes. Should radio broadcasters bleep out the music that they play publicly? Yes. Should a band playing in a private venue (paid entrance) have to be selective about their lyrics? No. In particular, "faggot" can be a very strongly discriminative word. Just like "nigger" though, context and intention are paramount. As far as I'm concerned, there's a big difference between some random guy calling me a faggot (out of hatred) and a friend of mine calling me a faggot (out of playfulness). I've never encountered the alleged stereotype associating homosexuality with monetary wealth. If anything, I've encountered the reverse. Gay youth are statistically more likely to be homeless and/or be involved in substance abuse, both of which arguably preclude being rich. Calling someone a rich faggot is still calling them a faggot. One doesn't make the other any better. Edited by Lexanimus, Saturday Jan 15 2011, 03:01 PM.
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| Isura | Saturday Jan 15 2011, 04:51 PM Post #7 |
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Instead of trying to force a discussion by saying something stupid, try just starting an actually interesting discussion. Saying that you put those in on purpose feels dishonest, and that you were playing me. Back to the discussion, I agree with what Alex is saying, but (maybe? Alex didn't cover this in his post) in some different aspects. I think that the government has a responsibility to edit what content is presented as long as the format that is providing that content is being payed for by tax payer dollars. If a private station or publisher decides to edit their content in ways that I may not agree with on a political level, I have no problem with that. But so long as citizens are paying for it, those citizens have a right not to be discriminated against it. This isn't to say that governments should prevent those institutions that may be creating discriminatory content (so long as it stays within the law, such as not advocating violence), but instead that it should not help pay for them. As for the idea that some stereotypes aren't harmful so long as they are positive, I have to strongly disagree. Personally I think all stereotypes are by their nature negative because they force people to conform (or cause people to assume) that a person is a certain way because of something that they can't control, instead of understanding that people are necessarily different from each other, and that difference is a good thing. Being seen as caring and compassionate is generally a good thing, but in sexist stereotypes, it leads to women being assumed to be 'naturally' good at raising children, instead of seeing it as a skill that required work and learning, or as labour that should be compensated. By saying 'all asians are smart,' the work that some people from that ethnicity do in order to achieve the grades they want (certainly no small feat) is seen as insignificant, because it is assumed that they are 'naturally' good at it. Likewise, asians who are not adept at math (or whatever) as seen as defective, since they are not accomplished at something that is supposed to be 'natural'. |
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| Phrixscreoth | Saturday Jan 15 2011, 07:52 PM Post #8 |
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League of Legends kept me (mostly) sane~
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Hmm, Isura, I'm remembering that soapbox monologue you wrote in grade 12 about asians. That was funny. Yeah, probably the one thing worse then triggering a disscusion by saying something stupid is admiting you said something stupid to start the disscusion. Though I can understand the difficulty in starting a conversation with most members of this board, considering we (for the most part) all think the same way. The only upside I can think of at the mo about sterotypes is that it allows for humans who enforce the sterotype to feel belonging- you're either with the sterotype, against the sterotype, or a performer (actor, comedian, etc) using it to make jokes or quickly get a point/idea across (for the most part). However, yeah, sterotypes are very limiting. And while normally limits encourage creativity, these limits are not so much "we must figure out how to do this with these constraints" but "you must do this this and this or you are not that". Which actually reduces creativity, as the thought process is allowed to stagnate as you already know exactly what you have to do to "fit it", and as long as you stick with that people will possibly like you. No growth. |
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| Xamad | Sunday Jan 16 2011, 02:21 AM Post #9 |
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It is late but I quite enjoy the points you brought up. But I want to raise a few quick counter points (I would like to go into detail but as I have said I am kinda tired...)
Should they? Yes. Do they? Well according to Cee Lo Green's F*** you, you tell me.
It is not only about "bleeping" words out. It is the subject of the song. For example Soulja Boy's Crank That has very explicit content yet it was played on the radio. Lady Gaga's Love Game and Britney Spears' 3 were of much the same caliber. This is kind of a separate question intended for Isura but the rest of you are also free to answer. Is there at least some truth behind (some) stereotypes? Now to get completely off topic but remain on topic at the same time: Fox News (You know exactly what I mean). GO! P.S. Yes yes I hear (read) you loud and clear. For future I won't say something stupid just to get the discussion going. Finally I hope that this discussion keeps going and that our minds can be open to the opinions of others |
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| Isura | Sunday Jan 16 2011, 12:49 PM Post #10 |
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Thus the difference between a slur and swearing. Generally you hit a certain age, and someone saying 'fuck' is no longer the huge deal it once was. Thus radio stations may feel it acceptable to play uncensored songs with swearing after a certain point, say 9, when children (which the general consensus is that kids shouldn't hear or say swear words) have gone to bed, while slurs that say that a certain type of person is less valuable as a member of the human race because of some trait may never be acceptable to play. As for the 'songs about sex with swears edited out,' honestly I have no opinion on that. You may not like that song producers are aiming fairly explicit songs at pre-teens, but so long as they are not promoting hate speech, it's really a completely different kettle of fish. The different between 'if you go down on me I'll go down on you' vs 'See the little faggot with the earring and the makeup Yeah buddy that's his own hair That little faggot got his own jet airplane That little faggot he's a millionaire' should be pretty self apparent. I think that 'truth behind stereotypes' is a bafflingly stupid idea. Mostly because if you pick out any trait and apply it to any group, there are always going to be some people who fit into it and some people who don't. |
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| Ladyfrog | Sunday Jan 16 2011, 08:09 PM Post #11 |
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Pantless Dancing
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Censorship in music has always been a funny game. I dunno so much in North America, but in the UK, the government and the 'powers that be' have always stuck their nose in the music game. Hell, in the 60s, the British government banned all rock music on the radio, forcing renegade DJ hosts to create pirated radio stations in international waters (Related sidenote: FUKKIN WATCH The Boat that Rocked/Pirate Radio, Amazing soundtrack and fairly accurate in how these operations were set up.. give or take all lolz stuff in that movie. >.>; ). The reason why rock was banned was because it had guitars and seemed 'ungodly', with suggestive lyrics and a completely different sound from the norm. Also orignally the 'top of the pops' show was literally, all pop music. Nothing with a bit of aggression in it until (dont quote me on this one) I think it was 'the jam' played on national tv, allowing a new sound to a music craved generation. Hell, British radio/top charts banned Hot hot heats song Bandages because of its 'suicide' based lyrics because a few people complained. You also have to take into content of when these songs were written. When some yuppies complain about a song written 30 years ago, you have to understand what was the meaning of said song 30 years ago. dire straights song seems to be referring more to the glam hair band rock of the time, and the wording, although strong, is hardly the worse thing i've ever heard on the radio. WHAT ABOUT THIS 80'S CLASSIC FROM CANADIAN GROUP 'ROUGH TRADE'? High School Confidential
Saw someone mention Cee-lo Geen's "f**k you' above in the comments. He released another ver., entitled 'Forget you' for mass radio play. He isn't using the lyrics to be derogatory, or insulting as usually the phrase is used, but it describes the anger he feels for a girl who he loved deeply, but she only cared for what he had in his pocket. Its a catchy song, great violent hook that people can relate to as everyone's known a gold digger or two. Also, ever go back and listen to some of the pop music played in the mid 90s-2000s? Talk about explicit. HERDERDERDER ONCE AGAIN AND ONCE MORE WITH FEELING! Remember how often you heard these songs? How old were you? Do they still compare to modern day music's content of sexuality? I'm usually on side with the artist when 'the man' tries to stop creativity or censor it, and I can understand the need to censor hateful music and slurs, but the artist and the music they create is released, it is up to the interpretation of the individual to take it in its stride. For example: Eminem - Superman/Any-most old Eminem song. Fantastic beat - great hook - thoughtfully written lyrics (even if they might be offensive to some, its not a 'I FUKKIN HATE THEM WHORE GIRLS WHO TRY AND START SHIZ WITH ME I FUKED YOU ALL NIGHT WITH YOUR ANKLES OVER MY HEAD' lyric, its written with some tact) Aside: 3rd Verse is Gold.
... Now i might be going onto an Eminem binge... ty
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It's a raw night Who wants to bar fight? Well come on alright And I dare a motherfukkah to come in my face Baseball bats I got somethin' for that It goes bla ka ka kat So I dare a motherfukkah to come in my face | |
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| onegirlarmy | Sunday Jan 16 2011, 08:28 PM Post #12 |
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I'm V and I like girls. A lot.
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Marry me? |
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La la love you don't mean maybe! | |
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| Xamad | Sunday Jan 23 2011, 09:24 PM Post #13 |
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In regards to the stereotype tangent |
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| onegirlarmy | Tuesday Jan 25 2011, 02:23 AM Post #14 |
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I'm V and I like girls. A lot.
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Please tell me you aren't justifying stereotyping people (ie being predjudiced and often discriminatory) with this article. |
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La la love you don't mean maybe! | |
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| Phrixscreoth | Tuesday Jan 25 2011, 10:42 AM Post #15 |
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League of Legends kept me (mostly) sane~
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That's a good question, the article wasn't summed up in Xamad's post for easy reading. |
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