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| Long Wheelbase Cj-3b?; Uday, we need your help. | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mar 23 2009, 09:56 AM (1,167 Views) | |
| mcspool | Mar 23 2009, 09:56 AM Post #1 |
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See ebay item no. 170313744361. The seller states this is a "1958 CJ-3B willys Jeep - X Army, Long wheel base 4X4". As far as I know, the Australian Army did not use any lwb jeeps. But it could be a prototype? But where did this LWB CJ-3B come from? Is it a Mahindra CJ-4 or VIASA CJ-6? Regards, Hanno |
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| derekredmond | Mar 23 2009, 10:37 AM Post #2 |
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Thanks for the link Hanno -- this is a good set of photos of a CJ-3BL, modified at time of import by Willys Australia. 20 inches were added to frame and body, on an unknown number of the approximately 1000 3B's they imported. So it's actually quite a bit rarer than the seller claims. And his claim that the Jeep was used by the army is likely pure fantasy. See more info at http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/World/Australia.html Derek
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Derek Redmond Kingston, Canada 1959 CJ-3B http://CJ3B.info/About.html | |
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| oldtime | Mar 23 2009, 11:10 AM Post #3 |
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Interesting ! I feel certain this truely is a 1958 imported Willy's as described. The serial plate number appears to be 57348-47889. That places this particular Jeep late in 1958 along with a batch of Jeeps that apparently were also shipped to Australia at about that same time. I don't know anything about the Australian army so I won't comment on that claim. If you look closely at the frame shot you can see two vertical welds on the frame. One weld is seen just behind the tailpipe and the other is just barely visible about 20 inches foreword. This frame uses one pair of additional body mounting brackets. Obviously Willy's did not form LWB frame channels in one piece, but rather modified the 80" WB frame by adding a 20" section of frame channel. The use of H shackles is not unheard of during this same time-line. We also get a glimpse of the RHD throttle linkage. Most everything looks to be standard Willy's except the parking lamps and of course the RHD rear view mirror. |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B . Rock Crawler using factory parts from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new | |
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| derekredmond | Mar 23 2009, 01:35 PM Post #4 |
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Aside from the fact that there's nothing on this CJ-3BL to indicate military use, we do know that the Australian army specifically rejected the civilian CJ-3B when Willys Australia started importing them in 1958. Their report at http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/Military/AustArmyTest.html makes interesting reading. The Australian Air Force did use quite a few CJ-3B's -- see http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/World/AustraliaRAAF.html for example. Derek |
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Derek Redmond Kingston, Canada 1959 CJ-3B http://CJ3B.info/About.html | |
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| mcspool | Mar 23 2009, 03:51 PM Post #5 |
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Derek, Ken, Thanks for the replies. All I could find in one of Bart Vanderveen's books were pictures of the Mahindra CJ-4 or VIASA CJ-6. Regards, Hanno |
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| JeepMKD | Mar 23 2009, 06:00 PM Post #6 |
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I saw this thread late, but I decided to reply. I think that Mahindra never had Willys stamped on the grille, tail gate or the hood, so this further confirms it's an original Willys. JeepMKD |
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A true Willys Jeep lover from Macedonia! 1970 Mahindra CJ-4 Wagonette Article & photos --> http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/World/MahindraMacedonia.html | |
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| John C | Apr 4 2009, 10:37 AM Post #7 |
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I'm not entirely sure that Mahindra Jeeps 'never had Willys stamped on the grille, tailgate or hood'. I have seen a Mahindra hood on an old model Mahindra (I tried to buy it on eBay but it went way too high for a chopped about Mahindra) that had 'Jeep' stamped in it. I was told that the licencing agreement meant that Mahindra could use the Jeep trademark within its home market but not on export models which would sell in markets where Jeep itself sold vehicles. This was definitely the case here in the UK during the 80s and 90s imports - the vehicles couldn't use the Jeep trademark in the UK while Jeep were selling Wranglers. Flat fenders forever JC |
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| JeepMKD | Apr 4 2009, 11:43 AM Post #8 |
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They didn't have 'Willys' stamping, they only stamped JEEP only on the grille. This is my CJ-4. If you look closely, you will notice the writing. This is a rare (one of 3,304 ever made) LHD Mahindra, in India they drive on the opposite side so all the vehicles are RHD, just like in Great Britain. ![]() |
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A true Willys Jeep lover from Macedonia! 1970 Mahindra CJ-4 Wagonette Article & photos --> http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/World/MahindraMacedonia.html | |
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| John C | Apr 4 2009, 03:51 PM Post #9 |
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Interesting to hear - the Mahindra story isn't as well-recorded as that of the US Jeeps so it's detail information like this that fills out the story. I have got an old newspaper photo though of a CJ-3B in India with Willys in the grille but, of course, it might be a Willys not a Mahindra... Cheers, JC PS - nice Mahindra you have. 16in wheels? |
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| derekredmond | Apr 5 2009, 08:39 AM Post #10 |
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Here's a photo from India of a Mahindra with JEEP on the grille and WILLYS on the hood. It appears to be original but of course the hood could be a replacement -- photos without documentation don't necessarily prove anything, especially in this era of Photoshop. Details on this Jeep are at http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/World/Mahi...hotosPart2.html (where you can also see John's Mahindra which does have a replacement WILLYS grille.) Derek ![]() |
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Derek Redmond Kingston, Canada 1959 CJ-3B http://CJ3B.info/About.html | |
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| JeepMKD | Apr 5 2009, 12:51 PM Post #11 |
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People in India heavily modify the Jeeps, often beyong revocgnition. It's probably not original. They add all sorts off aftermarket parts, notice the dual latches on the hood. John C, yes they're 16in wheels. We were using the NDT tires, but they're not available anymore. Those were last produced by the "Tigar" company in Serbia. I still have the NDT tires the Jeep came with - made in India in 1970!!! Now the Mahindra sits on Russian tires built for the Russian off-roader Lada Niva. These are 4cm lower than the 6.00 x 16!!! |
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A true Willys Jeep lover from Macedonia! 1970 Mahindra CJ-4 Wagonette Article & photos --> http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/World/MahindraMacedonia.html | |
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| yjcanibul | Apr 5 2009, 01:11 PM Post #12 |
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the picture Derek posted visually looks very similar to an original vintage 3B in north america except for JEEP on grill which is either willys or non existent when Kaiser ran out of them ... the india jeep/3B even has the ventilated windshield like mine ... thats amazing |
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57 3B : big speedo / Hurricane / YF 938 SD / IAY-4012 / T90 / D18 / 5.375 final drive / open diffs / Firestone 6ply Military NDCC / 12v Delco SI alt / Kayline Top / venting windshield / tub patched / "still fixing leaks one at a time" 89 wrangler : h/duty axles + 5spd / 200+hp 4.2L / arb locked / multiport fuel inj / warn hubs+winch / 1/4 mil km / fishing+trail riding / gets me to work | |
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| derekredmond | Apr 6 2009, 07:47 AM Post #13 |
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Yes, it appears to have been modified very little. That's what makes this one unusual, and why I think it's possible the hood is original. Many of the Mahindras came from the factory with the extra hood latches. We need Uday Bhan Singh to tell us whether any Mahindras had WILLYS stampings. Derek |
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Derek Redmond Kingston, Canada 1959 CJ-3B http://CJ3B.info/About.html | |
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| John C | Apr 13 2009, 04:17 AM Post #14 |
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I'm of the opinion that it will be a real Mahindra with original Willys stampings. It all, I believe, depends on which trademark was being used at the time the agreement between a foreign company and Willys/Kaiser etc was made. Mahindra was one of the early companies to make an agreement with Willys. JC |
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