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| fuel pump; Can't seem to find a rebuild kit | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 20 2012, 02:50 PM (1,536 Views) | |
| jking | Aug 20 2012, 02:50 PM Post #1 |
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The pump is marked AC on the housing and 9971 on the thin area of the mount. It's a dual action with the glass bowl. Am I going to be able to find a rebuild kit? Walck's has one for a 4080, will that work for me? Seems a bit pricey at 70 bucks. Thanks, John |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| Rus Curtis | Aug 20 2012, 04:12 PM Post #2 |
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John, Have you contacted these guys? http://www.maritimedragracing.com/then_and..._automotive.htm |
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Rus Curtis Alabama '54 CJ-3B "Green Gruntt" Bantam T3-C | |
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| oldtime | Aug 20 2012, 07:47 PM Post #3 |
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Never heard of the AC 9971. It's not the original. It's extremely hard to locate pump repair parts for the AC 4693 It's very hard to locate pump repair parts for the AC 4080 It's hard to locate pump repair parts for the AC 4032 See page 3: http://z4.invisionfree.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_B...opic=4218&st=30 |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B . Rock Crawler using factory parts from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new | |
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| jking | Aug 20 2012, 09:13 PM Post #4 |
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haven't lost the camera usb cord yet.![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| jking | Aug 21 2012, 11:15 AM Post #5 |
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Oldtime pointed this out to me - http://www.ebay.com/itm/180777925322?ru=ht...5322%26_rdc%3D1 Very different from mine - but the same main body I guess. My vacumn section was full of oil - normal? I'm going to continue dissassembly, cleaning , and inspection. I figure I'll need diaphrams and gaskets at the least. Wonder if there was some standardization of those among AC types. Rus, put an email into that site - maybe I'll get lucky. Thanks. |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| jking | Aug 21 2012, 12:46 PM Post #6 |
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BINGO !!! Thanks for the link Rus! 59.50 + 8.50 shipping. Regarding my last post - on the two different 9971's "What they have is a pump that was rebuilt at some point in time, and the rebuilder just used a 9971 body, changed the arm and fuel casting to make it fit another car. I see this same thing so many times, and it causes quite a bit of misery when the customer gets the wrong kit. The kit I have, fits the glass bowl pump" |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| oldtime | Aug 22 2012, 11:18 AM Post #7 |
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NO. I'm not an AC expert but I suspect that the AC 9971 was not originally equipped with a glass fuel dome. AC got away from using glass domes by the mid 1960's. By the 1970's AC pumps were not longer repairable. |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B . Rock Crawler using factory parts from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new | |
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| jking | Aug 22 2012, 11:42 AM Post #8 |
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Hmmmmm. Didn't figure that oil should have been in there. Will inspect carefully upon full disassembly. I don't doubt what you are saying OT. I'll look over the parts kit and compare each to it's matching piece. Will post pics. |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| jking | Aug 27 2012, 09:17 AM Post #9 |
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Took the pump all apart and cleaned it. Oil only in vacumn section, must have been the oil seal. Compared the kit to my parts : Here see where PO didn't want to find a washer and welded again. Unfortunately, I punched it through the bore. Hopefully sealant will fix that up on reassembly. Should have been patient and filed it down. ![]() ![]() Check valves are different but same diameter. Taller though. ![]() ![]() I think I will have to notch the top of the cork so it centers properly.
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| jking | Aug 27 2012, 09:22 AM Post #10 |
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More on kit Screen different, definately not going to work but the old cleaned up. ![]() diaphrams seem to match but hooks a little different ![]() ![]() ![]() Old fuel side diaphram not bad - vacumn one dry rotted.
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| jking | Jan 23 2013, 11:25 AM Post #11 |
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It was 5 degrees out tonight, so too cold to work in the garage. I decided to attempt to put together the fuel pump. I've run into some things: 1) the old oil seals were installed such that they "pointed" into the chamber where the arm attaches. A diagram from Ludel's rebuilders manual confirms this. However the seals seem to fit much better into the seal steel "retainer?" so that they would pointed towards each of the diaphrams. Below I've provided some pics. Note that installed as shown in my diagram, that the end of the seal looks like its going to come into constant contact during movement with the end of the shaft as opposed to always riding on the shaft. Seems like that contact would quickly wear the seal. The old seal and diagrams are in conflict with my intuition. 2) The replacement shaft is not tapered like the original and requires a clip on both ends to hold it in place. 3) During assembly, the fuel diaphram seems to clip right in to the arm. However, the vacumn diaphram "seems" to also. Any trick here to ensure proper attachment. ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Thanks, John |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| M606 | Jan 23 2013, 09:32 PM Post #12 |
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Here is another source for fuel pumps rebuild kits: http://www.maritimedragracing.com/antique_...arts_cellar.htm |
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Luiz Felipe Santos 1965 Kaiser M606 1951 Willys M38 Rio de Janeiro, RJ Brazil | |
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| jking | Jan 24 2013, 12:09 AM Post #13 |
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Thanks Luiz, That's where I got my kit. My immediate issue is ensuring that I install it properly. |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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| Bob | Jan 24 2013, 07:55 AM Post #14 |
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This is great information. I have a range of fuel pumps lying around and I'll pick the right one to rebuild for mine. I did a replacement pump when I restored the jeep, but would rather have the original back. Esp. since the shaft on mine seems to want to creep out of it's bore. |
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Bob 1953 CJ3B 1965(?) CJ5 1949 Jeepster 1947 Cj2A 2004 Kubota l3400 | |
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| jking | Jan 25 2013, 10:19 AM Post #15 |
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The pump is back together. So I'm concluding this post with my experience. Below I have listed my “tips” on reassembling the AC dual action pump that I have. I am not a rebuilding expert and this is the first one I have done. So consider these beginner tips. I’m sure others that have more knowledge and experience have different and/or better techniques. I specifically list the details of dealing with the two diaphragms. The first two steps are critical if there is any delay between the time you take it apart and put it back together, like me. I was just lucky I took them. 1) Take pictures of the three areas where the check valves are so that you know the proper orientation of the values. 2) Take a picture of the fuel cap to document the orientation of the fuel ports. The cap screw holes are such that you can easily attach the cap incorrectly. 3) You can use properly sized sockets and a rubber hammer to seat the check valves and oil seals. Do not forget to install the paper gaskets. 4) After the oil seals and check values are in are you are ready to assemble the diaphragms, take some time to carefully examine the diaphragm shaft ends and the action arm. The vacuum diaphragm shaft attaches to the end of the arm while the fuel diaphragm attaches to the center of the arm. With these three pieces only, carefully examine how they attach. Determine the angle and path they must take to attach and make a mental note. You will basically have to perform this operation in limited space, under spring load( fuel), with little to no visibility. 5) Lube the end of the vacuum shaft so that it will easily slide thru the oil seal. You don’t want to damage the seal. 6) Insert the vacuum diaphragm shaft thru the oil seal. Align the seal which will in turn align the shaft properly. Insert the action arm into its opening, leave out the arm’ spring for now. 7) Using what you learned in step 4 attach the vacuum arm. You can manipulate the arm and the diaphragm a bit to get it connected. Pull on the center metal piece of the diaphragm to ensure connection. 8) Lube and insert the fuel diaphragm, this one is spring loaded so you’ll have to apply constant pressure to keep the shaft in the opening while you attach it. Manipulate the arm and diaphragm as necessary, taking care not to detach the first shaft as it can slip off easily and you’ll have to start over. Verify the connection the same way but be careful as the fuel one is spring loaded and can detach and fly into your face or even worse, your spouse’s face. In which case you’ve got a boatload of more trouble than a broken fuel pump. 9) Once both are attached, use something long and narrow to temporarily secure the action arm into place – I used a long narrow punch. You want something narrower than the action arm shaft because you need a little play in there. 10) Install the fuel cap (first because it is spring loaded). Remember to check the fuel port orientation. You don’t have to tighten it all the way down or use all the screws, you’re just trying to secure them enough so that the shafts don’t dislodge from the arm. Do the same with the vacuum cap, it only goes on one way unlike the fuel cap. 11) Install the action arm spring. You’ll have to have a little patience to manipulate it properly, but the temporary shaft should provide enough play to seat and load the spring using some screwdrivers. I used a small one to seat it and a larger one to load it. I chose to do this at the end as trying to keep the spring in place while installing the diaphragms would require an extra hand. 12) Secure caps completely. 13) complete the job by installing the action arm shaft with some sealant. My replacement shaft was not tapered like the original, I'm cleaning up the original and using that. This was my technique-some more experienced guys here may point out some flaws in my process and please feel free to do so – I don’t want to lead anyone astray. |
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1958 CJ3B F134 engine\Dana 25 with Spicer type axles\Dana 44 rear\T90 trans\Dana 18 transfer case. Northest Ohio | |
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