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| Sooty plugs and tail pipe; sooty tailpipe and plugs engine dies | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jan 4 2013, 02:31 PM (727 Views) | |
| Galen | Jan 4 2013, 02:31 PM Post #1 |
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I have a Carter carb which was professionally rebuilt (Walck - sub to Daytona Parts) but my plugs are sooty and so is the tail pipe. When I run the engine and its warmed up the motor dies and will not start for a long time sitting. Everything is stock and plugs are set correctly (.30). Could the problem be the float setting or wrong fuel jets. Any thoughts? No back or miss fire- engine recently rebuilt < 100 miles. Original style single stage fuel pump. |
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1954 CJ3B -Transport Yellow- 1953 B4 Dodge Power Wagon 1941 Dodge WC 1/2 ton military 1967 Plymouth Valiant Culpeper, VA | |
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| Galen | Jan 4 2013, 05:53 PM Post #2 |
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I forgot to add that when warmed up my 3B dies while idling. I can start it but shortly thereafter the motor quits. NO backfire. |
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1954 CJ3B -Transport Yellow- 1953 B4 Dodge Power Wagon 1941 Dodge WC 1/2 ton military 1967 Plymouth Valiant Culpeper, VA | |
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| Ratchet | Jan 5 2013, 08:37 AM Post #3 |
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I had this same problem with a Dodge WC. Turned out to be a bad coil. It would run untill the coil heated up and then it would quit. After sitting for some time it would restart. A bad/week coil can also cause a week spark - sooty plugs. If you have a spare its worth a quick swap an see. |
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Georgetown, IN A little less rust and a 53 CJ3B | |
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| jyotin | Jan 5 2013, 09:42 AM Post #4 |
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The YF carburetor equation... YF + rebuilt by someone not familar with jeep 4 cylinders = flooding Unless the YF was rebuilt properly it can result in flooding and excessive fuel consumption. Sometimes it just runs exceptionally rich; sometimes it throws fuel all over the manifold. Sometimes it does either depending on its "mood". Just because a professional shop rebuilt it does not mean they used the right parts. In fact, it many times guarantees the wrong parts are going to be used. Every jeep YF I've had that had the wrong parts inside exhibited exactly the same symptoms you describe -- and sometimes the jeep wouldn't even run at all once it got warm Fortunately the cure is easy, but it can run around 60 or so dollars.... So.. Disconnect the "-" side of the battery. Put a towell or rag over the battery. Remove the top of the YF (you can remove the entire carb if you wish, but if you are careful about not dropping parts you can leave the carb mounted Next remove the float Next, remove the needle in the float valve. Should be a needle with a pin and spring inside the needle -- if not then the needle valve is the wrong one Next, take the pin that held the FLOAT on to the carb housing and drop it inside the needle valve seat. If the pin goes all the way in and into the aperture on the inside of the valve then it is the wrong valve. If the valve fails either test you will need a new one. If you need a new (and correct) valve you can get one at www.thecarburetorshop.com -- although they'll sell you a whole kit that includes the valve. Be sure to have the YF model (it's on the webbing of the carb) handy, but it is probably a 938-SD. BTW, the reason why the wrong float valve gets installed is that the majority of YF's were used on larger engines that demanded a larger float valve. Jeep (4 cyl) used a much smaller valve with the associated pin and spring in the valve -- it was sorta unique to jeep. So the tech rebuilding the YF goes to the shelf and grabs the generic kit and prest - o - change -o ..... a flooding YF goes out the door and to the customer. If that is the problem then perhaps you could go back to the vendor and ask for some sort of relief on an improper rebuild -- jeep vendors should know better, but most don't care. Hey - they'll just say it is too old to rebuild and sell you a Solex!! (which has its own set of problems) j |
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It's just my luck that something good is going to happen to me today. 54 - 3B - down on the farm 67 - cj6 - former state of Alabama vehicle ?? - cj5 T98a - made from spare parts - Ford tractor blue ?? - cj5 T98a - made from spare parts - Jeep green | |
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| oldtime | Jan 5 2013, 11:10 AM Post #5 |
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Please identify the spark plug manufacturer and the heat range. Due to usage of the choke during cold weather it will be hard to get rid of the excess carbon especially on short trips. In other words it may be considered as normal in cold weather.
This condition is often caused from a bad condensor or an intermitant functioning coil.
The carburetor is not likely to have the wrong jets installed. But it is possible. Please identify the carburetor specific YF model number. The Carter number is stamped sideways upon a thin web of the fuel well body. If you do remove the air horn assembly from the fuel well then do so just after the engine dies. Simply put a ruler into the fuel well and measure the depth. That will determine if correct fuel volume is being supplied into the fuel well. That is the true "BASIS" for determining ability of YF to function properly. The YF cannot function properly if the level of fuel in the well is too far from standard depth of 1-1/8". For more on depth of fuel in the well read: http://z4.invisionfree.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_B...?showtopic=4359 |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B . Rock Crawler using factory parts from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new | |
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| Galen | Jan 5 2013, 03:05 PM Post #6 |
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Thanks for all the ideas. I advanced the timing and it runs a little smoother ( I have only one mark on the timing cover). and after cleaning the plugs, seems to be running less sooty. However, motor quits idling after warmed up and running for about ten minutes. It did this a couple of times them I let her sit for about ten minutes and when I cranked the motor, it would not start. I checked the fuel in the bowl and its at 1 1/8 inches-on the line cast on the outside of bowl. I am of the feeling it is the coil or condenser as Rachet and Old Time suggested. What about the plugs themselves? |
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1954 CJ3B -Transport Yellow- 1953 B4 Dodge Power Wagon 1941 Dodge WC 1/2 ton military 1967 Plymouth Valiant Culpeper, VA | |
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| Galen | Jan 5 2013, 05:22 PM Post #7 |
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Oh yes, the plugs I am using are Delco R45 |
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1954 CJ3B -Transport Yellow- 1953 B4 Dodge Power Wagon 1941 Dodge WC 1/2 ton military 1967 Plymouth Valiant Culpeper, VA | |
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| oldtime | Jan 6 2013, 02:39 PM Post #8 |
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That's a part of your soot problem right there. There is absolutely no need to install resistor type spark plugs if you have suppression spark plug cables. Suppression type spark cables work pretty well but the resistor type plugs are not desireable. Non resistor type spark plugs provide much superior performance. Superior ignition systems will use solid copper spark cables and non resistor plugs. The following list shows my preference by desending order: MAKE...................NUMBER NGK.........................B6Y CHAMPION................J8C AUTOLITE.................295 AC DELCO................45 |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B . Rock Crawler using factory parts from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new | |
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| Galen | Jan 8 2013, 08:24 AM Post #9 |
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Replaced my Delco plugs with Champion J8c plugs (couldn't locate 4 NGK plugs locally) and does seem to react positively. Ran engine for 20+ minutes with long duration of idling and engine did not quit. Still a little soot on new plug but that maybe due to rich fuel as its cold out and not running under load. I will take her out on the road today to see if there is any problems. |
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1954 CJ3B -Transport Yellow- 1953 B4 Dodge Power Wagon 1941 Dodge WC 1/2 ton military 1967 Plymouth Valiant Culpeper, VA | |
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3:45 AM Jul 11