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| DJ3A DISPATCHER CONVERTIBLE; RESEARCH THREAD | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Dec 6 2013, 05:39 PM (10,288 Views) | |
| F Bill | Dec 31 2013, 09:15 AM Post #76 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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I think the body fastening bolts actually attach that holy grail bracket to the side of the tub.. 5/8 long would be plenty to go thru the bracket, body side and leave extra after nuts are installed on the underside. Your comments about length are dead on in my opinion. I do think we need to figure out whether the bows are individually pivoted from the tub bracket or the front one only with the rear bow somehow attached to it. The parts listing shows no separate bracket but it does list 2 ea of 3/8 24 by 7/8 pivot screws for bot to REAR pivot bracket. (as well as the four bolts you mentioned earlier to attach the front bow to the body. ) I wonder if you didn't get the bracket with the front bow already attached , as there seems to be no listing for a pivot bolt for it. I'm going to ask the former owner of the DJ3A from Bill Norris's calendar shot if he can get us in contact with the new owner in Memphis....our pleas for help on eWillys and the other flatfender sites have stopped getting any new results. I will post some pics of the parts book for those who do not have one. Note that these pics are for the top used with the solid back and the low silhouette windshield. There is another thing I just noticed I will post about next. |
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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| F Bill | Dec 31 2013, 09:33 AM Post #77 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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Page 142 from the parts book. upper part of page is for the high windshield top. ![]() ![]() Page 143.. some is a repeat of page 142.... ![]() ![]() ![]() These are form the yellow covered Dispatcher parts list from Feb 56. |
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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| F Bill | Dec 31 2013, 09:41 AM Post #78 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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Notice about halfway down page 143 it lists tacks.....a valance??? and a welt with tips....and where it says they go... on the top bows.... Hmmmmmmmm. It is starting to look like the top cannot be removed from the bows once installed. And somehow you tack the top to the bows, which means either they are thin metal you nail to or they have inserts made of fiberboard or wood or?? Also....there is a top boot listed, I assume to cover the folded top. but it also requires 11 single turn studs, which I would assume were the 11 studs we see on the windshield frame, not the back of the tub where a boot would go. I have a feeling this boot was no longer supplied on later jeeps like my two. OR??? Any thoughts?? The plot thickens...... |
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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| PapaC | Dec 31 2013, 10:14 AM Post #79 |
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Papac
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The FIRST thought I had when I read this? Memphis is a short trip for me. Pass through there all the time going to Arkansas to visit my wife's family.... The second thought. The idea of the front bow coming in already fastened to the bracket is brilliant. Hadn't thought of that....... |
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Charles Tate....North Mississippi 1956 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible Doing ground up nuts and bolt restoration by almost entirely reconditioning original used or a few NOS DJ3A parts. 1962 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible. (For research and parts only) | |
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| PapaC | Dec 31 2013, 11:24 AM Post #80 |
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Papac
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A number 4 tack is a very small tack, 1/2 inch long A tacking strip, from way back when is a roll of cardboard material. Let me see if I can explain. Fasten the cover to the wood. Run the welt and fasten it with the welt barely sticking above the edge of the wood. A welt is a piece of material sewed around a round piece of cardboard or wire covered with cardboard to protect the material. The 'roll' cardboard tacking strip (there's also a tacking strip with the tacks incorporated in it but that doesn't apply here) is reinforcement to secure the material and the welt to the wood and make the welt stand up, secure and tight, just above the piece of wood. Fastened in the old days with tacks, and now days with staples. Fold it over and pull it back, and all you see is a neat finished piece of cover, decorated with the welt sticking up. The wood, tacks, raw edges, tacking strip, are hidden underneath the cover. A valliance is the top part of a curtain. In our case, I associate it with the part of out top that fits over the top of the windshield. ______________________________________________________ Wasn't a trunk lid on old cars also called a boot? What if they're calling our top itself the boot? |
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Charles Tate....North Mississippi 1956 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible Doing ground up nuts and bolt restoration by almost entirely reconditioning original used or a few NOS DJ3A parts. 1962 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible. (For research and parts only) | |
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| F Bill | Dec 31 2013, 11:34 AM Post #81 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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Can't be, the top itself is already listed.. Boot is an English (UK) thing... but I can't remember if it means top or trunklid. In the US a top boot has always been a cover for a folded top... Yes, I see a trip to Memphis in your future. Lets hope Lindsay can get us some contact info. |
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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| PapaC | Dec 31 2013, 11:37 AM Post #82 |
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Papac
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Ok, scratch that off :rolleyes: The boot thing that is. Memphis, I'm ready to go!!! |
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Charles Tate....North Mississippi 1956 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible Doing ground up nuts and bolt restoration by almost entirely reconditioning original used or a few NOS DJ3A parts. 1962 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible. (For research and parts only) | |
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| Bill Norris | Dec 31 2013, 02:29 PM Post #83 |
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F Bill, I was just at the library and they had a Dispatcher brochure with the boot you are talking about, in place. It actually comes down quite far on the rear tub. I wish I had scanned that in when I was there. I'll have to see if I can get over there again soon. I was not sure if it was the guy from Memphis that bought the DJ3A. If you have Dennis Caraway's contact info, he is close friends with him and should be able to get you in contact with him. Bill |
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| F Bill | Dec 31 2013, 03:02 PM Post #84 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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Thanks, Bill. I'll try and get hold of Dennis, he bought a trailer from me a long time ago. |
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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| Bob W | Dec 31 2013, 08:23 PM Post #85 |
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Perhaps the front bow did not "fold" as you would expect. Remember this is a Willys Jeep top
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Bob W www.cj3a.info | |
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| PapaC | Jan 1 2014, 01:59 AM Post #86 |
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Papac
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Who knows Bob Every time I think I'm getting close I seem to find something that makes me know less! I ain't near giving up though!!! Had a WILD New Years party tonight. Me and the wife setting here watching TV. My little dog at my feet. And me drinking a cup of coffee or two. No alcohol involved, got over that a loooong time ago. I wouldn't have it any other way. HAPPY NEW YEARS everybody. . . . . . . . . Oh, by the way......betcha ain't seen one of these in a while. Since this IS connected to the CJ3B site thought I'd throw it in for good measure. (Just found it) If you get one though better be careful. The way that tops sagging you might wind up with a swimming pool over your head!!! . . . .EDIT: I now believe this to be a PROTOTYPE top along with a Very RARE ventilating windshield as identified by FBill:.......charles tate . . . . . ![]() http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/Finds/Finds1.html |
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Charles Tate....North Mississippi 1956 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible Doing ground up nuts and bolt restoration by almost entirely reconditioning original used or a few NOS DJ3A parts. 1962 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible. (For research and parts only) | |
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| PapaC | Jan 1 2014, 03:23 AM Post #87 |
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Papac
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If I don't write this down I won't be able to sleep. Observations about 'this image'. I don't know much about convertibles but I do know cover. (material). I just knew in my heart that there'd be no way to get the slack out of cover using this type windshield fastening system for a convertible design. Or any other thing using that profile over the top from front to back. In fact I noticed Oldtime just commenting the other day about the difficulties of stretching and installing a best top or tiger top. Oh, and Ken. As a roofer here in a Mississippi I definitely know what the Dog Days of summer are! Second and perhaps more important thought. I don't have a printer. If I did I'd print that picture out. Then I'd take a straight edge and draw on it the outline of those bows that are leaving an impression under the cover. Then I'd draw a bracket on the top edge of the tub just about where they meet it. Last I'd draw pin holes on the bracket to fasten the bows. Yep. If I had a printer I think that drawing would be real interesting. Bill. Think you could talk somebody into trying that little experiment? Any volunteers with a printer? please......... |
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Charles Tate....North Mississippi 1956 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible Doing ground up nuts and bolt restoration by almost entirely reconditioning original used or a few NOS DJ3A parts. 1962 WILLYS DJ3A Convertible. (For research and parts only) | |
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| SteveK | Jan 1 2014, 10:19 AM Post #88 |
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Happy New Year people, Interesting pic Charles. Now I know why you can't sleep...coffee in the middle of the night...lol... or maybe it's just your passion for the project... My useless observations are 1) great job with the half door. 2) there's a opening style windshield there. 3) and top related, the front bow seems to be back further than in other pics, causing the front area to be disproportionate from the next section. That said, the bow appears to be sewed in, (if that is stitching straight up the top), and there is no sign of the bow on the other side appearing it may be covered up. The front bow seems to be lower (less drainage angle) than in other pics too. Another reason for the slack might be the fact that you can see out at the right rear corner as if the top is ripped, or not fastened there, allowing the top to pull forward and create the sag. The dirt on the rear bow location indicates to me the rear bow goes all the way to the outside of the body instead of on top of the body (the dirt wouldn't have a straight path to follow at an angle beyond the mount), and the non-straight line of snaps along the rear bottom of the top, and the opening looking like it may have a zipper enclosure, make me think this is not a factory setup. The doors indicate someone's creative capabilities too. If there isn't but one thing we have learned about the Willys, it is there is 'more than one way' to get the job done. Has any effort been made to seek out information from the Historic Vehicle Association? Maybe they have archives, or other resources to research the facts?? Maybe they have a picture of a museum piece convertible available??? Thanks for all the shared information. Here's hoping 2014 is a SAFE and productive year for us all! SteveK |
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SteveK 62 Dispatcher South Florida | |
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| F Bill | Jan 1 2014, 12:44 PM Post #89 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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I think that is a custom top on a very custom High Hood 3B,,,,,and not what we are looking for. However it is pretty darn COOL! I love those doors too...I may have a set around here if I can remember where I put them. You can see the bows on the inside of the passenger side...EDIT: At first glance they appeared to be.very close together. But if you look at where the top drapes over the bows, the front bow is in the normal position..Do I see a THIRD bow behind the driver's head? or is that just a shadow? What I can't tell is what forms the door opening...looks to be more than just the edge of the canvas. We are working on contact info for the jeep in Memphis and might even have another surprise up our sleeves if we are reeeely lucky.. So we WILL get there... Gotta get back to packing the truck and finishing some signs before I leave later today for Colorado. Anyone who is watching this thread,,,if you have pics of an original convertible style top or its bows, please share them. If you can't post pics, you can email me at NFord2N on aol.com Happy new year everyone! |
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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| F Bill | Jan 1 2014, 12:47 PM Post #90 |
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Jeep discovery and aquisition specialist
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We do know the convertible did not use the Willys bow sockets the 3A did. We have factory pics of the top folded down...I don't see how you could conclude it did anything other than fold, but as you said, this IS Willys........
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59 convertible 15933 needs drivetrain 60 convertible 17052 has a V6 and 4WD 60 Surrey 17509 went thru Katrina and looks it. 60 Surrey 17918 started it all...Toyota axle, BW Wrecked Surrey Tub with fenders and grille 56 tub, from 11826 And a couple parts DJ's with no ID left. All my jeeps are projects....only runner is my DJ with doors.. | |
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