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HISTORY IN THE MAKING 2008-2016

Good luck!

We've spent a good many years discussing politics, life, society and history. Most of all, the makers of history. The great events that changed the world - people, places, actions. Small acts have changed its hard-worn course, and effort and circumstance can make of its small actors immortal greats. In line with that sentiment, it seems pertinent now to recognize the potential of those who've made up this community for years, obvious through their contributions to the spirited debate and discussion that has proceeded here. HITM has sadly gone silent, though perhaps not lacking for things to say about making history, but rather for the realization that it is time we all commenced to do so, and make our mark.

Good luck to you all, see you in the history books!
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Gaza
Topic Started: Jan 5 2009, 07:09 AM (2,400 Views)
TheNewRommel1
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Administrator

No, My logic which is actually simpler than what you like to make it sound complicated is, the Israeli casualties don't justify the Palestinian costs.
The heart should only exist to pump blood to the brain and rest of the body anything else is a waste of time and energy.

Love and Hate are only impediments to the human condition.

Imagine what could be accomplished if only the human race could shed our humanity.

When the facts change, my mind changes. What do you do, sir?

AWESOME HITCH (CLICKY)
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

DragonLegend
Jan 16 2009, 07:19 AM
Ww2nerd
Jan 15 2009, 11:31 PM
No. I'm not accusing America of any genocidal tendenties Dragonlegend. You take WAAAY to much out of context. What I am saying is that they have been killing innocent civilians in an empty cause.

I disagree. I can clearly remember you saying something on Agecomm about how the Bush Administration massacred thousands of innocent Iraqis for economic gains.

Don't change the subject. Answer my question: Do you have proof that a member of Bush's cabinet ordered the killing of innocent Iraqi civilians for genocidal purposes/economic gains?

Yes or No?

Nope. Don't do that you lying idiot. It's one thing to forget I've said stuff, it's another to willingly lie.

I never once said they killed thousands of innocents. They kill far more than they have any right to. What they should have killed:
0
Because they didn't ask them to come in the first place, and this is just America meddling in YET another country's business.

Ok, sorry. Bush didn't personally order the killing, but I bet you anything that that guy's political background is republican. And as far as I'm concerned, even ordering that unjust war is ordering them to kill innocent people.

"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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I'd love to discuss the justification of the war, but meh.

And don't lie, Rommel. You really did say on Agecomm that Bush (or America) butchered thousands of innocent Iraqis for economic gains.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Quote me then, with a link to the post.

"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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Jack the IV
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Say hello to my little friend
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DragonLegend
Jan 17 2009, 07:53 AM
I'd love to discuss the justification of the war, but meh.

And don't lie, Rommel. You really did say on Agecomm that Bush (or America) butchered thousands of innocent Iraqis for economic gains.

It was for economic gains.
Posted Image
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Commie-Red
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Admiral
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UPDATE:

JERUSALEM – Israel declared a unilateral cease-fire in its 22-day offensive that turned Gaza neighborhoods into battlegrounds and dealt a stinging blow to the Islamic militants of Hamas, but the government said its troops will stay in the Palestinian territory for now.

Shortly before top leaders voted for the cease-fire at an emergency security meeting, Hamas threatened to keep fighting until Israeli troops leave Gaza.

"Our goals as they were set at the beginning of the operation were fully realized, and even more than that," Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said after the 12-member Security Cabinet voted to halt the assault.

"Hamas was hit hard, in its military arms and in its government institutions," Olmert said. "If the fire stops entirely, the IDF (Israel Defense Forces) will weigh pulling out of Gaza at a time that befits us. If not, the IDF will continue to act to defend our residents."

More than 1,200 Palestinians have been killed and 4,060 wounded since the Israeli offensive began on Dec. 27, according to Palestinian and U.N. officials. At least 33 Israelis have also died, with 160 wounded.
"Religion is never a problem, it's the people who use it to gain power."
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Neverseperat
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G'nral
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I say if they are being attacked, the need to fight back :warrior:
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Neverseperat
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G'nral
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Jack the IV
Jan 17 2009, 09:00 PM
DragonLegend
Jan 17 2009, 07:53 AM
I'd love to discuss the justification of the war, but meh.

And don't lie, Rommel. You really did say on Agecomm that Bush (or America) butchered thousands of innocent Iraqis for economic gains.

It was for economic gains.

Jack are you german?
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Commie-Red
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Admiral
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I wonder how long it'll take Hamas to break the cease-fire, and shoot another missle at Israel.
"Religion is never a problem, it's the people who use it to gain power."
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Moreover, how many innocent people must die before they both just friggin stop fighting over religious bigotry.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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Ww2nerd
Jan 17 2009, 05:59 PM
Quote me then, with a link to the post.

Don't play stupid; you damn well know the thread was deleted.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Meh, not my problem. They did kill thousands of innocent Iraqis in pursuit of economic gains, but that doesn't mean genocide.

And dragonlegend, if you weren't a dumbass, you'd know what I mean when I made that comment.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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Wow! Sorry, but "the butchering of thousands of Iraqis" iis genocidal.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Well then, I guess it's a genocide. They have killed over 3,000 civilians for an empty cause, in a country they were not invited to invade, which posed minimal threat to them, but was attacked because of falsified documents the president used as a propaganda reason for starting the war...........

Honestly, I don't have to go any further than saying this:
Number of Iraqi Civilians that should have died because of Americans: 0
Because America never should have been there in the first place.

Number of Iraqis killed because of American action: 3, 000+ (And that was a total back in 05) Because of an action which is doomed to failure, but you are all too stupid to see it. Religious sectarian violence is a plague in that country, and nothing any of you do is going to fix that. It's still going to be a shithole, just one with a powerless democracy.

I'm just appalled at how stupid the President was to order this action. Because fact is, it cannot concievably succeed, and if you don't realise that, you have a severe mental deficiency. IT IS RELIGIOUS, AND THAT CANNOT BE BEATEN. LOOK AT ISRAEL. Now, you've invaded the Arab lands, which is what pissed them off and made them fly planes into the trade centers in the first place, but now, rather than the threat being imagined, youre president was smart enough to make it real.

I say keep american troops in Iraq for another 20 years, let them keep dying, and hopefully the casualty figures will deter it from starting such aimless wars again. They need a butchery like stalingrad to ensure that The presidency will not start such aimless wars again without thinking carefully.

I would say that for Canadian soldiers 2, if this wasn't thier first conflict since Korea.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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Lazurath
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From a Land Down Under
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Dragon, sure the Democracy in Iraq has been successful (enough), but that's not all there is to it. Basically what the Americans have done is invaded their country, got rid of Saddam and set up some sort of Democratic government However, they haven't tried to set up an effective government. Sure, you can choose who leads you, but your country's still going to be, in the worlds of Ww2, a shithole.

What the American's goal should have been was to restore order (as best as they can, I'm telling you now Iraq will never have full order if it continues like this), set out to improve infrastructure, trade and self-sustainability, and then make a democracy happen. Whilst I agree that Democracy is important (to some extent), a stable country is FAR more important.

It'll be like if I went to start a new country in the middle of the dessert, and the first thing I did was hold elections for a government. I don't have the resources, trade or infrastructure to run my country properly.
Sefless protector
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