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HISTORY IN THE MAKING 2008-2016

Good luck!

We've spent a good many years discussing politics, life, society and history. Most of all, the makers of history. The great events that changed the world - people, places, actions. Small acts have changed its hard-worn course, and effort and circumstance can make of its small actors immortal greats. In line with that sentiment, it seems pertinent now to recognize the potential of those who've made up this community for years, obvious through their contributions to the spirited debate and discussion that has proceeded here. HITM has sadly gone silent, though perhaps not lacking for things to say about making history, but rather for the realization that it is time we all commenced to do so, and make our mark.

Good luck to you all, see you in the history books!
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Great Moments in Bureaucracy
Topic Started: Mar 9 2010, 03:32 AM (562 Views)
DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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The US Patent Office can’t accept faxes that are upside down. They used to when Einstein worked there because he knew how to rotate a document 180 degrees, but now he’s gone and apparently no one knows how to do that. I didn’t even know there was a right-side-up and upside-down to the fax machine; I just paid attention to making sure the printed side was facing the right way.

Anyway, this is the government that wants to run your health care. Luckily, if the death panel decides you need to die, they’ll probably screw that up too.
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Lazurath
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From a Land Down Under
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DragonLegend
Mar 9 2010, 03:32 AM
Anyway, this is the government that wants to run your health care. Luckily, if the death panel decides you need to die, they’ll probably screw that up too.
No Dragon.
Sefless protector
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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Please stop spamming...
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_Иван_
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Level 6 bydlo
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DragonLegend
Mar 9 2010, 12:19 PM
Please stop spamming...
No Dragon.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

There aren't any Death panels. People who think there are or will be are morons.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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That part was a joke, if you didn't notice. Maybe you also think the Einstein part was serious?

And, actually, there is a "death panel" in the Senate bill.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Seriously?
Are American lawmakers that stupid?
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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That's the only way for the government to keep costs down: Rationed care. It comes with the package. The package being universal health care.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Sure, and 45 million without adequate healthcare is private.

Canada has universal healthcare, we don't have rationed care.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
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Those 45 million aren't "without adequate healthcare." They simply have no health insurance, for any number of reasons, from not having a job at the time of the study (the figure is from the Census Bureau) or because they choose not to, as do most rich people and many, if not most, young people. They do have access to health care, even if they couldn't pay for it, though.

And of course Canada has rationed care. What do you think waiting lines are?
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Practically non-existent. I'm telling you legend, it's totally over-exaggerated what the American papers like to say about Canada.

And it's healthcare that'll probably make them not want to live after they figure out how much they owe.
Edited by Ww2nerd, Mar 10 2010, 01:22 AM.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
Non-existent? Why, not according to this Fraser Institute study:

Quote:
 
As of this year, 694,161 Canadians are on a waiting list for medical procedures. Assuming one person per procedure, that means 2.08 percent of the population is queued up for “free” care, according to the Fraser Institute’s annual survey on wait times.

These Canadians pay for their health care in both taxes and the hard currency of pain, anguish, and lost wages…

Worse, an incredible 16 percent of the population — five million people — is waiting to get a primary care doctor.

Once they get one, they have to wait yet again. On average, Canadians waited 16.1 weeks from the time their general practitioner referred them to a specialist until they actually received treatment in 2009, according to the Fraser Institute. That’s 73 percent longer than the wait in 1993, when the Institute first started quantifying the problem.
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Ww2nerd
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Scion of the Midnight Sun

Ok.... so, we still get in soon for anything needed, and don't have to mortgage off the house?

I'm sorry Legend, I still fail to see how that's better than being an uninsured American.

Also, statistics Canada flatly contradicts that statement. Average wait time is 3 weeks for non-necessary surgeries.

At any rate, it's moot point trying to blame the system.
The government has no stipulations so far as wait times are concerned. Doctors choose. They just have different ethical criterion than in a private hospital where money rules. If you are sicker, you go first. It is not government law. A doctor could pick a kid with his finger scraped, compared to somebody with their heart ripped out of their chest. They don't, of course. But it's up to the doctor, and they're the best suited to make that choice anyway.
Edited by Ww2nerd, Mar 10 2010, 01:58 AM.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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DragonLegend
Field Marshal
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
And that is a rationed care. You have to wait until the doctor/government says it's your time.

In America, you're treated immediately.
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Ww2nerd
Member Avatar
Scion of the Midnight Sun

ORLY?
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/07_28/b4042072.htm
http://getbetterhealth.com/wait-times-for-medical-care-how-the-us-actually-measures-up/2010.02.02

Statistics Canada has similar figures. 3 MONTHS FOR MEDICARE PATIENTS? Canada averages 3 weeks for most surgeries and scans!

Oh, and I'm not sure if you know this: but your doctors have to pick and choose as well. They just look for the fattest pocketbook. In Canada, Doctors look for the sickest patient.
Here's a good one, with some nice looking sources:
http://www.healthcarereformmyths.org/HealthcareReformMyths.php

And that patients united now video? Funny as hell.
"My government wouldn't help me, blah blah blah"

And she went to the US... convenient they don't mention costs, or the fact that the government paid for her American fees? Or.... is she even a Canadian citizen? Government runs HC in Canada?

Really, I just find the whole mess funny.
Edited by Ww2nerd, Mar 10 2010, 02:19 AM.
"There are strange things done in the midnight sun,
by the men who moil for gold; the arctic trails have their secret tales that'd make your blood run cold...
the Northern Lights have seen queer sights, but the queerest they ever did see...
was that night on the marge of Lake LeBarge, that I cremated Sam McGee."

- Robert W. Service
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