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New point system opinions.
The new proposed point system should go into effect: 11 (55%)
The current VR system should stay as is: 2 (10%)
We should keep the in-season+ Playoffs 5 (25%)
We should just have a repeating cycle season w/ no playoffs 2 (10%)
Total Votes: 20
New point system opinions.
Topic Started: Aug 12 2011, 07:10 PM (695 Views)
THE TITAN
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Division 1 Admin

Part of our ideas for restructuring S4 will be a more traditional point system similar to the of the the MKL and WCL. However, we still would like to reward clans for achieving wins by a high margin. Poll will go to vote.

Our proposed new system is:

Option 1:
- 3 points awarded for a Big win (by a margin of 80+)
- 2 points awarded for a regular win (below 80)
- 1 point awarded to a team who lost by a low margin ( -20 or less)


However, we can keep the regular VR system if people wish it. There will also be a vote on the poll for whether or not we should have playoffs at the end of the season. Some clans hate it, others like it. We felt that it added a big competitive spin here, but it is subject to change if people wish it.

Edited by THE TITAN, Aug 12 2011, 07:14 PM.
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Agosta44
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Where was I when this was being discussed, lol. Either point system works, really. It's the same concept with different formats. I agree with the point for losses under 20 points though.

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Casey B
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Points FTW. :P
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Paco1995
New Guy
I prefer this new system. Is simpler than the current one and adds a point for a loss less than 20.
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THE TITAN
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Agosta44
Aug 12 2011, 07:40 PM
Where was I when this was being discussed, lol. Either point system works, really. It's the same concept with different formats. I agree with the point for losses under 20 points though.
Quote:
 
I prefer this new system. Is simpler than the current one and adds a point for a loss less than 20.



Yeah this is why we are offering the reformation to the point system because a lot of people are not happy about losing extra points for getting raped, and not getting anything at all when they barely lose.

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Rookie


I'd say we have the new system for S4, and have playoffs, but also give out a banner for most regular season points, and use +/- to determine ties, like the WCL. However, I think there should still be playoffs.

In all honesty, I really liked season 1's playoff format, where all 8 teams got to play in a brackett and 4 banners were gave out for winning the final match. Since double match weekends were an issue, why not just put playoffs at the end of the season? It'd extend the season to 10 weeks, but that's just as much as the WCL anyway, but with more excitement in every match W10. Everybody could participate this way, and seedings wouldn't be random like in S1, instead the new point system would rank the teams 1-8, and round 1 would be 1v8, 2v7, 3v6, & 4v5? This way everybody would get to play the same # of matches with loser bracketts. Also, if the winner of 1v8 played the winner of 4v5, and 2v7 & 3v6 winners played, you'd be more likely to see a 1v2 or even 1v3 (which is still intense considering the 3 seed beat the 2 seed) final match than just a "all they have to do is beat this 3-7 team to win the division title" like what sometimes happens in WCL. Just something to put out on the table.
Edited by Rookie, Aug 13 2011, 01:24 AM.
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THE TITAN
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I was thinking maybe double points for the for top-4 teams that make it(or something equally climatic). A lot of teams did not like that all their points and VR went out the window to a playoff format that ended in a knockout tourney.

I do like the idea of playoffs, but I think we can do a better job this next time around with the format so that it incorporates a team's achievements during the in-season.
Edited by THE TITAN, Aug 13 2011, 07:10 AM.
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Rookie


Well, I agree that playoffs shouldn't count for vr / points, I think points should only be there to determine everybody's playoff rank.
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Agosta44
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I decided to take a look at the difference between this point system and the current one. Like I mentioned earlier, it doesn't really change the outcome.

Current D3 standings:
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With the new point system:
Gotei xiii-2 13
TeamGameCave 10
Nintendo Connection 6
Flow 2 5
Extreme Crew 3
Meteor 2 2
D'oeuf 2
Patience 2


As you can see it doesn't really change the outcome with points. I personally like the current point spread system. If it was tweaked to give points or prevent point deduction for losses within (-20), we could essentially keep the old system. I think it's more of people not understanding it than it being unforgiving.
Edited by Agosta44, Aug 13 2011, 11:56 AM.

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Rookie


I just like the new system because it's more simple.
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THE TITAN
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I think that's a pretty strong argument.


Edit: Ok well

I think most of the staff agreed on keeping VR and readjusting it to the new format

+30VR for a big win

+ 20VR for a regular win

+10VR for a slim loss

0 VR for losses by a margin of 21+

No VR taken away from teams for losses.


As for the playoff format..

Maybe up the VR by 10pts to each catagory or something. We'll see I guess.
Edited by THE TITAN, Aug 14 2011, 02:35 AM.
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Rookie


Don't think playoffs should count for vr, I think they should be totally different, vr should be used for only playoff seedings imo
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THE TITAN
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Yeah that's how we have it now. We'll see how it goes. We also thought about having divisions of 6 because of the extreme difficulty with seeding 8 clans, but then again, 6 clans per division would cause other problems (including an incomplete bracket for a playoff structure).

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Agosta44
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If points aren't going to be deducted for losses, we might as well just trash the system and go to a traditional point spread (since no point deductions makes it the same thing, just with more numbers).

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Rookie


8 clans should stay, it makes the league unique in my opinion. As for Agosta, I completely agree.
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dark563
Rookie
the one we have now is so very punishing, not only does your opponent gain VR, but you also effectively lose VR. In other words +15 to them, -15 you yourself creates a 30 point margin that is incredibly difficult to gain back with the current system imo.
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Rookie


especially since there's no rematches ^
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dark563
Rookie
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Aug 18 2011, 02:05 AM
especially since there's no rematches ^
yeah that only adds to the hurt since that means we have to recover the thirty points through big wins which is quite hard since 80+ is quite big. (and not to mention that the other team can also get big wins which makes recovering that margin almost impossible).
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Agosta44
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dark563
Aug 18 2011, 01:52 PM
Rookie
Aug 18 2011, 02:05 AM
especially since there's no rematches ^
yeah that only adds to the hurt since that means we have to recover the thirty points through big wins which is quite hard since 80+ is quite big. (and not to mention that the other team can also get big wins which makes recovering that margin almost impossible).
Well if you look at the way the league is set up anyways, you only play other teams once. If you lose to one team, you need to depend on other teams to beat them, and need to play well against others to regain points. As I showed in a post earlier on, even with point deductions, things balance out. Staff could probably discuss seasons as well as playing rematches. Hopefully next season, we can get more clans to participate, as well as recruiting ones that won't drop out. We've had 2 teams drop from every division this season I believe.

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THE TITAN
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Agosta44
Aug 18 2011, 03:42 PM
dark563
Aug 18 2011, 01:52 PM
Rookie
Aug 18 2011, 02:05 AM
especially since there's no rematches ^
yeah that only adds to the hurt since that means we have to recover the thirty points through big wins which is quite hard since 80+ is quite big. (and not to mention that the other team can also get big wins which makes recovering that margin almost impossible).
Well if you look at the way the league is set up anyways, you only play other teams once. If you lose to one team, you need to depend on other teams to beat them, and need to play well against others to regain points. As I showed in a post earlier on, even with point deductions, things balance out. Staff could probably discuss seasons as well as playing rematches. Hopefully next season, we can get more clans to participate, as well as recruiting ones that won't drop out. We've had 2 teams drop from every division this season I believe.
The new point system will more than likely be in effect since it seems to be in the majority.

I do believe that clans who perform extremely well in matches, should get rewarded for them. The thing that I really disliked most about the the WCL's point system (during my time competing there) was that a team could lose three matches (while another team only lost two) and that team could still win if all their losses were slim. In reality, that clan was not the better clan because that team lost more times than the other(s).

With this point system (in theory), If clans are evenly matched, it will show. If a clan is extremely dominant over all, it will show. Since the majority of clans (competing from the MKL and WCL) favor the slim loss point system, it is the will of this league to honor that which is favored in majority(as long as it's ethical). This league will generally never go completely against the communities wishes unless it's completely ridiculous, or goes completely against the MKC's founding core values.

Hypothetically speaking, if for some odd reason, the community in majority decided to favor trolling (FML), we would probably change our way in favor of it.

So I guess for now, the new proposed point system will go into effect in S4. No date has been determined as of yet.


As for our format, the 8-clan divisions will stay since 6 clans would mean we would have to end playoffs and repeat the cycle. As of now, ending playoffs doesn't seem to be favored.

Edited by THE TITAN, Aug 19 2011, 06:16 AM.
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