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Tattoos
Topic Started: Sep 14 2011, 04:38 AM (997 Views)
Aerovox
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Is it wrong for believers to get tattoos?
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stratcat79
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What is the Biblical definition of idol worship? Taking the Lord's name in vain was being done then. It is part of our culture today. Does our culture define right and wrong or does the Word of God. We sin. We have a Savior from sin and death. It's not OK to sin, but we do have a Savior; and the sin is as much sin now as it was when it was defined in the Bible.

As for issues of the heart, it is still desperately wicked, only now our heart fights the permanent fixture, which was not but now is, of the laws, both old and new. He made a covenant, which we keep and break. Jesus did not destroy the law, but fulfilled it. Commandments like those dealing with cutting and marking on the body were not done away with. Some people of old time and even present day think it is wrong for a surgeon to cut into the body based on Lev. 19:28, but we need to keep the context of that verse in mind to then realize it does not apply to medical issues but rather to pride and those sorts of issues.

To those who have tattoos, I see it as sin. Earlier in the forum I did not have Biblical reference, but thanks to some kind folks, I found Biblical basis. It's OK, though, just carry on and sin no more (not that I am your judge - God forbid). The Bible was written for all ages, cultures, times, nations, etc. Popularity or acceptance by society must not be our standard. The Bible in and of itself, through the guidance of the Holy Spirit, to worship God in Spirit and in Truth, is in fact our standard. The book of James is very good at explaining the fallacies of bending to whichever way the wind blows and how wrong it is to do that. The path of least resistance is often the broad gate and wide way that leads to destruction, and many there be that find it.

The Spirit was telling me that tattoos are wrong, even before the Bible reference was shown to me. Then He spoke clearly through His Standard through Lev. 19:28. God often times does that, and I have confidence He has done this sort of thing with you fine folks as well... given you discernment BEFORE even showing the answer in His word on issues of various sorts. Until I find it backed up in Scripture, though, I refer to my responses as my "opinions" until God lets me know one way or the other what is right.

Thank you for reading this, and I hope those with "tats" understand I am not trying to get all over your case, but am trying to help. I hope I've helped and not been of discouragement.
Edited by stratcat79, Jul 10 2012, 07:37 AM.
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S.T.Ranger
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ddown
Jul 9 2012, 02:40 PM
What is the Biblical definition of idol worship? Taking the Lord's name in vain was being done then. It is part of our culture today. Does our culture define right and wrong or does the Word of God. We sin. We have a Savior from sin and death. It's not OK to sin, but we do have a Savior; and the sin is as much sin now as it was when it was defined in the Bible.

As for issues of the heart, it is still desperately wicked, only now our heart fights the permanent fixture, which was not but now is, of the laws, both old and new. He made a covenant, which we keep and break. Jesus did not destroy the law, but fulfilled it. Commandments like those dealing with cutting and marking on the body were not done away with. Some people of old time and even present day think it is wrong for a surgeon to cut into the body based on Lev. 19:28, but we need to keep the context of that verse in mind to then realize it does not apply to medical issues but rather to pride and those sorts of issues.

To those who have tattoos, I see it as sin. Earlier in the forum I did not have Biblical reference, but thanks to some kind folks, I found Biblical basis. It's OK, though, just carry on and sin no more (not that I am your judge - God forbid). The Bible was written for all ages, cultures, times, nations, etc. Popularity or acceptance by society must not be our standard. The Bible in and of itself, through the guidance of the Holy Spirit, to worship God in Spirit and in Truth, is in fact our standard. The book of James is very good at explaining the fallacies of bending to whichever way the wind blows and how wrong it is to do that. The path of least resistance is often the broad gate and wide way that leads to destruction, and many there be that find it.

The Spirit was telling me that tattoos are wrong, even before the Bible reference was shown to me. Then He spoke clearly through His Standard through Lev. 19:28. God often times does that, and I have confidence He has done this sort of thing with you fine folks as well... given you discernment BEFORE even showing the answer in His word on issues of various sorts. Until I find it backed up in Scripture, though, I refer to my responses as my "opinions" until God lets me know one way or the other what is right.

Thank you for reading this, and I hope those with "tats" understand I am not trying to get all over your case, but am trying to help. I hope I've helped and not been of discouragement.
Okay, hope this comes across in a brotherly fashion, lol, but I do have comment on your post, brother. While I would not advocate tattoos nor would I get one myself, we have to approach this with a view to the big picture.

Now for you, it seems that getting a tattoos is a sin, and for you, it would be, should you get one. However, I believe that if one, like the fellow that I went on a mission trip with, got a tatto to honor the Lord, that is between him and the Lord.

Now the big picture is this: if we are to take a legalistic stance on this command from Leviticus 19, lets take that a step further.

Such as...there is no work to be done on the Sabbath. And we can approach this from two ways, with the true Sabbath which is Saturday, or...we could use what most refer to as the Christian Sabbath, Sunday.

If we say Saturday, then who here among us has since we were saved, kept this Law?

If we say Sunday, most of us might say, "Hey, I do pretty good on that one...I never work on Sunday!"

Oh really? Does that mean that we have obstained from all work perfectly since we were saved? You mean you never cooked something? That is work.

"But wait," one might say, "we are under grace, we don't have to keep..."

Exactly.

Shall we tell our brothers and sisters in law enforcement, medical, heating and air conditioning...lol, "Hey, take the day off that you sin not against the Lord?"

Here is a better one: "Preacher, you are just going to have to stop preaching on Sunday..." lol

Now this train of thought may seem irrelevant concerning tattos, however, the same principle applies. Here is a passage where our Lord touches on Law and Grace:




Matthew 12

King James Version (KJV)


12 At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn and to eat.

2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day.

3 But he said unto them, Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him;

4 How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests?

5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?

6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple.

7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.






What does that have to do with tattoos, one might ask? Just this: if we are going to enforce the Law, we must enforce the entire law. But we need not get that far with the discussion, because we know we are not under law, but under grace. That is not to say that we disregard the Law or despise it, God forbid, but we understand that it is precisely our hearts that are under scrutiny, and God knows the reason for all we do, whether it be for His glory, or it be for vainglory.

We must in certain areas decide how we will live and how we will lead the families we have been entrusted with, such as what day is the Sabbath, for example. This should not be an issue for most of us, for every day is to be holy unto the Lord, right? Sunday is not a day we try to be more holy, for we are holy, set apart unto God, and that is 24/7. But for the weak brother that has been taught Saturday is the Sabbath, it may go against his conscience to forsake this upbringing, and I do not see it as our place to other than try to educate him to a better understanding of service to God, especially when those with such a view come from very legalistic denominations. But let us not question his salvation...only his doctrine. And we do that with scripture and by the grace of God.

So, getting back to tattoos, I supplied Leviticus 19 (as did a few others, lol) for the purpose of showing that the intent of getting those tattoos was a form of idolatry. Is the man I went on a mission trip, who not only broke this law but actually had a graven image placed upon his arm (ouch)...guilty before God for breaking the law?

Personally, I say no. He did this at a stage where his understanding may have been questioned, but, his zeal for Christ could not be. Perhaps he may have come to regret that, or, as suggested before, it may be that his salvation was false and this tattoo may be a daily reminder, a goad, so to speak, that one day might actually lead him to repentance. Who knows?

Now I would have nothing against a man teaching his kids not to get tattoos, but I would be very careful that the Doctrine of Grace not be muddied by a legalistic approach to this instruction. It must be understood that salvation is not a matter of keeping the law in an outward form or appearance, but is of the heart, secured by the blood of Christ alone. As the Lord taught:


7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless.



This leads me to start a thread that is missing from this forum, a discussion about Law and Grace. We need to be aware that there are two errors that, as Christians abiding in unredeemed flesh and in the battle against the flesh, is very easy to slip to either side: first we have a legalistic view, and I think we all stray into that at times, and secondly is a tendency toward antinomianism, or, an "anti-law" attitude which is also in error, and I hope my post here does not seem to sound like I am advocating such a position. I am not. The Law is holy, good, righteous, and beneficial to man. There is not a law of God that you can keep that will hurt you.

Though, to finish this up, I might suggest a law or two that God would find offensive: how about offering up a sacrifice for your sin? How about going to a Levitical Priest rather than our Great High Priest, Jesus Christ?

So if we do not keep that part of the Law, what shall we say about the rest? Do no murder? No adultery? No stealing? Most of us would agree...they still hold true. But just as was true back then, it is not the outer appearance that keeps the Law of God, but the inner man, the heart of man. The Lord brought clarity to the desire of the Lord by commanding that we hate not our brother without cause (for in doing so we have killed him), by not lusting in our hearts for women other than our wives, (for in doing so we have committed adultery).

Just how are we to keep the Law of God?

We won't, apart from the Spirit of God, leading us to live holy, conforming us to the image of his Son, removing the image and likeness of the First Adam.

Okay, just rambling a bit. I will just say that we should be careful concerning Law, and especially when we are in need of mercy of the Lord for ourselves, and expected to show mercy to those around us. Again there will be things that we might outright consider to be sin, and be tempted to look down on others for committing them. But before we do, lets consider the level of understanding of our brothers and sisters. We do not look down on a baby for needing a diaper change, lol, so I believe we can, when it comes to our brethren, show grace when they do that which we might frown upon, lol.

God bless.
Edited by S.T.Ranger, Jul 29 2012, 05:45 PM.
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stratcat79
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Leviticus 19:28 is clear about marking and cutting your flesh.

What is "work" as the Bible sees it, but doing business for making money. Surely if your water pipe burst on the Sabbath, you'd fix it without it being sin. The Sabbath is still Saturday, and Sunday is "the Lord's Day". Doing the work of the Lord should be every day. Sabbath is a gift of rest for man, not a day to look for the "sin of doing work".

Marking up one's body is clearly described in what Leviticus says. Now if such things were done before becoming a believer, certainly God understands. In fact, the only unforgivable sin is by not becoming a believer, ever... eh?
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S.T.Ranger
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ddown
Jul 30 2012, 01:38 PM
Leviticus 19:28 is clear about marking and cutting your flesh.

What is "work" as the Bible sees it, but doing business for making money. Surely if your water pipe burst on the Sabbath, you'd fix it without it being sin. The Sabbath is still Saturday, and Sunday is "the Lord's Day". Doing the work of the Lord should be every day. Sabbath is a gift of rest for man, not a day to look for the "sin of doing work".

Marking up one's body is clearly described in what Leviticus says. Now if such things were done before becoming a believer, certainly God understands. In fact, the only unforgivable sin is by not becoming a believer, ever... eh?
Hello brother D, let me ask this: what would happen to the believer (and we are talking about a born again believer) that after salvation, for some reason decided to get a tattoo, such as the man I went on a mission trip with? Would it be thought that this would be an action which the Lord might chastize the believer for?

God bless.
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stratcat79
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Was the man aware of that part of scripture? Admittedly, I never really looked into it until the topic came up. I know that God judges the heart, and I don't want to be one of those that points a finger and says "God's gonna judge you for that." God may or may not. All I can say is, I wouldn't want to get the tattoo, knowing what I know now, but that's just me.
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S.T.Ranger
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ddown
Aug 3 2012, 10:55 AM
Was the man aware of that part of scripture? Admittedly, I never really looked into it until the topic came up. I know that God judges the heart, and I don't want to be one of those that points a finger and says "God's gonna judge you for that." God may or may not. All I can say is, I wouldn't want to get the tattoo, knowing what I know now, but that's just me.
I think most of us would probably feel that way, although an anchor on the right arm...lol, just kidding.

But what thie conversation has turned to, I think, is whether we should condemn those who are believers that feel they have liberty to get a tattoo. This is what makes the conversation interesting.

Have to get going, brother, hope to be back in the morning.

God bless.
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