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A Compelling Argument?; God or gods
Topic Started: Jul 8 2009, 07:29 AM (2,743 Views)
divinejoy789
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Okay so, I myself come from a Christian background being that my entire family is extremely bible-thumping to a fault. If they knew I was bisexual they would disown me and if they knew anything about any of these type of practices they might try to skin me alive. Maybe this is just a way to justify something to myself, maybe not, all I know is I got my mom to thinking with this one. (Without actually telling her that what I believe of course)

I personally do believe in God, while I don't consider myself 'Christian' exactly and I actually believe in multiple gods to an extent. I strongly believe in reincarnation, and I somewhat believe in a final afterlife of heaven and hell, although the details are fuzzy with me on that one, as I think I'll just figure out when I die and if I'm reincarnated again will forget it when I come back so I really don't think it's all that important.

So, here's my little argument/thought, why not more than one God in Christianity? A lot of christians act like multiple gods is some sort of horrible sinful Satanic offense because of a few places in the bible where horrible things happened to those who worship other gods.

Here is my support for multiple gods, basing it solely off the bible (which I actually don't put a lot of stock into, but just for the sake of argument assuming it's all true)

In the ten commandents, there are two lines that give strong support, in my opinion, to the existence of multiple gods.

Number one: "Thou shalt have no other gods before me"

Meaning, that while they do in fact exist, they are underneath god in a sort of hierarchy. Like God is King (king of kings and lord of lords! heellllooo) and the other gods and goddesses are princesses or knights, what-have-you of some sort. While I think it's a bit more complicated then that, that's a 'human' analogy. I believe there is a one God I believe he rules over other gods for other purposes.

Number two: "Thou shalt worship no graven image" or something of that sort sorry if it's weak with me not remembering the exact wording

Meaning don't make an idol and worship it (hello Catholics! stop with the Virgin Mary crap :P) and saying not to worship other gods because God is a "jealous God" and again I say, if he is indeed a 'jealous God' wouldn't there need to be other gods for him to be jealous of you worshipping?

So according to the bible, I see nothing against other gods existing, just against worshipping them.

Now correct me if I'm wrong of course, since I don't have the bible memorized or anything since, as I said before, I put little stock into it, but wouldn't that seem to be the case?

I don't honestly care if Christians believe in multiple gods, as I don't like to force my religions on anyone, I just wanted to know if any Christians admit that it is possible that multiple ones exist.

So what do you think, Christian or not, one God, multiple gods, both existing together, or is it just a moot point anyway?

I know I shouldn't really care but I just would like to have something to say in response to those Christians that try to harass me for believing in multiple gods and tell me that I don't really believe in God and that I have no morals, when in fact I have better morals then a lot of "Christians" that I know. I know I should probably just walk away, but what can I say? I enjoy debates. When it turns into an argument, then I'll walk away.

I just wanted to know if I had all my bases covered here :)
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Max
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Divinejoy, I consider myself a Christian in that I believe in Christ as the Son of God and my personal Savior.

Having said that, I haven't gone to "Church" in over 20 years. I find many modern "Christians" to be extremely judgmental and narrow-minded.

To answer your question, my personal belief is there is only one God,one Creator. But, I also believe in many mysteries, and that there are a great many things we don't know yet. For instance, there is a part in the Bible where Jesus disappears from his late teens until his early 30s. Could he have traveled the Silk Road to Asia, and both studied and taught there?

Could God have placed parts of what He wanted us to know all over the world so different groups would Have to come together? Why are their so many differences unless we are meant to learn from each other?

One thing I am sure about: God doesn't mean for us to hate people that are Gay,or Bi.....I'm sure of that.
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divinejoy789
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Ugh my mom talks about that all the time. She says "God doesn't want us to hate any one type of person for whatever reason" but then she turns around and goes off about how all gay or bisexual people are horrible sinners and terrible people and how they'll burn in hell. So she doesn't hate gay or bisexual people, she just thinks they're horrible excuses for human beings *eye roll*

I'm glad to see an open-minded Christian :) I live in the smack dab center of the bible belt so that's a very rare occurence here.
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Max
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:) I know people that would say I'm a Heretic. I myself just pray to the Father in Jesus's name and trust Him to guide me, you know?

I also think God wants us to keep looking for answers.
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newbloodmoon
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Well honestly at the time when the 10 commandment were written was when the Jews roamed the desert after escaping from Egypt. Egypt as with many of the religions of the day had several Deity's. Perhaps this is the reason for the monotheistic view on gods as only needing one. Zoroastrianism was one of the first monotheistic religions with a clear good vs evil motif and that Judaism had borrowed from them and in turn Christianity borrowed from Judaism.

So to answer your question on whether there are actual other Gods and Goddesses, I simply don't know. As one religion becomes prevalent in an area they tend to wipe out and absorb the old. Perhaps it was merely a way to get the people away from the worshiping the graven images they were used to seeing while captive in Egypt.

I hope this helps to a degree.
I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.
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onyxcougar
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The passages you quoted could be interpreted as "Don't worship anything more than me."

That could be money, sex, power, whatever you put over your love of the creator God.

There were lots of other Gods being worshipped in Egypt at the time, and this is why Judaism was so different, and why the Jews were supposed to live apart from the Egyptians (or any other "corrupting" influence.)

And I totally have a serious problem with Catholics. But I won't go into that here. I consider them as much a cult as the mormons.
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divinejoy789
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Haha I just find it funny that a lot of Catholics (the higher-ups anyway) violent (edit: err violate... Freudian slip? haha) their own rules written in their precious books and try to justify it.

I just think that there's a difference between worshipping multiple gods and believing in them, after all there are even quite a few 'Christians' (myself being one of them) that believe in God but don't take the time out of their day to pray to or worship him. Now that is considered bad in a Christian's eyes as you should have a relationship with God, but if I'm also not worshipping the other gods that I believe in, how am I sinful in believing they exist?

I guess it doesn't really matter anyway as I have a completely different religion than anyone I know. It's just that Christianity is the closest one I can identify to, because I believe in God and have a lot of the same moral identifiers of abstinence and treating your body as a temple (a lot of people forget that one) I just think it's funny how they all pick and choose what to follow and what to not, and then criticize another person for something that doesn't technically violate their rules anyway.
Edited by divinejoy789, Jul 11 2009, 06:50 AM.
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onyxcougar
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I know what you mean about having your own "religion", mine is a mixture of Wiccan/Christian beliefs. Lots of folks don't think those two go together, but they can.
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Darknight
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divinejoy789
Jul 11 2009, 06:49 AM
I just think that there's a difference between worshipping multiple gods and believing in them, after all there are even quite a few 'Christians' (myself being one of them) that believe in God but don't take the time out of their day to pray to or worship him. Now that is considered bad in a Christian's eyes as you should have a relationship with God, but if I'm also not worshipping the other gods that I believe in, how am I sinful in believing they exist?
Now isn't this something that your religion is against? I figure most people this day an age would easily point out the fact if your christian or not depending on your believes.
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Ashley Star Child
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well, originally the hebrews had multiple gods, but one king over them all which is Yahweh. Those other 'gods' are angels as God said they would be gods themselves, the sons of God, Bene Elohim, but you shouldn't worship them as God, or Yahweh is king and father over them all. Which brings us to the question, is there more than one son of God, the answer is yes there are myriads of sons of God which are angels but Jesus is actually like God cloned so he is THE son of God.
Does a fallen angel deserve a second chance? You decide
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Delovely
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divinejoy789
Jul 8 2009, 07:29 AM
So, here's my little argument/thought, why not more than one God in Christianity? A lot of christians act like multiple gods is some sort of horrible sinful Satanic offense because of a few places in the bible where horrible things happened to those who worship other gods.
In Christianity, there’s only one God, one being, one existence and Jesus Christ is who He is. Therefore, there’s no such thing as multiple gods. We might consider his names, which, are obviously A LOT but there’s only one God. There are so many arguments and contradictions in the Christian history but the most important thing is you follow what you believe in.
All the commandments of God or Words of God in the entire Bible, most importantly the 10 Commandments is a guide to eternal life, a guide to happiness and peacefulness as we keep on living. It’s how He wanted us to show our love for him.

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Number one: "Thou shalt have no other gods before me"
Meaning, that while they do in fact exist, they are underneath god in a sort of hierarchy. Like God is King (king of kings and lord of lords! heellllooo) and the other gods and goddesses are princesses or knights, what-have-you of some sort. While I think it's a bit more complicated then that, that's a 'human' analogy. I believe there is a one God I believe he rules over other gods for other purposes.
This Commandment brings us back from day one when God started creating everything in the universe. Some people believe in different things like nature, the natural forces, animals, astrology, etc., has it occurred to them that there’s only one Creator of all these things?
So in my understanding, this Commandment reminds us that there’s only one Creator of all things, that anything or any religions that tell us our life depends on them or our life originated from them is a false belief - that our life wasn’t created by any other gods but only God, Himself.

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Number two: "Thou shalt worship no graven image" or something of that sort sorry if it's weak with me not remembering the exact wording

Meaning don't make an idol and worship it (hello Catholics! stop with the Virgin Mary crap :P) and saying not to worship other gods because God is a "jealous God" and again I say, if he is indeed a 'jealous God' wouldn't there need to be other gods for him to be jealous of you worshipping?
Aside from what Onyxcougar mentioned, I think that this Commandment talks more about how we perceive God. It tells us we came from the likeness and image of God and can only be transformed into the spiritual image of Christ. Therefore, to worship idols or keep any representation of him distorts our perception of His image.
Some things must be handled smoothly, quietly.

"When you are deluded and full of doubt, even a thousand books of wisdom are not enough. When you have realized understanding, even one word is too much."
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XNavyGunner
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Odin!!!
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recondaws
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Realize people that there are many forms of Christianity. Each one of them believing in their own way. So using the term Christian in a broad sense simply means someone who believes in the Christ, not in the God or a God. The Idea of multiple Gods is a sound argument. And there are more Bible versus that will point to the support of that.

Incidentally Onyxcougar a cult is defined as "a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies. " according to Dictionary.com and most other dictionaries as well. So in that inference all religions are cults including all forms of Christianity.
"What a lovely night. It makes me want to have a bite to drink." - Alucard
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Wabbit
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All dictionaries have several and conflicting definitions of what a cult is, it's one of those 20th century words that has come into the language by the back door, meaning many things to many people, it depends on your geographical location and belief system and social structure as to what it means to you.

That said the general consensus seems to be that a cult is a religion or value system that differs from society and main stream norms. Being typically small scale and often contentious. hence cult films and cult books.

This would therefore preclude it's use for describing all the main stream religions as cults, resulting in two streams of religious belief, namely "main stream" and "cult" (meaning everything else).
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recondaws
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All right I accept that response Wabbit. So can the word cult refer to a religious group that has split from a Main Stream religion, or is the group that split still considered main stream?
"What a lovely night. It makes me want to have a bite to drink." - Alucard
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