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Poacher; Thomas Pigeon
Topic Started: May 12 2014, 08:29 PM (1,752 Views)
Posted Image largeone
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Norwood ont.

Muskox, Bison Kills Net Man and Production Company Thousands in Fines
I am not trying to stir up crap but i heard this on news and just want to no is this old or new havent seen or heard of it befor

largeone



Jeanne Pengelly
May 12, 2014 12:05 pm
A man pleaded guilty to killing muskox and wood bison, for the purpose of having video footage for a tv show.

Ministry of Natural Resources investigated for five years, before laying the charges against the Toronto-area man and his video production company, Dancing Buffalo Productions.

Thomas Pigeon said he killed the animals in the Northwest Territories and Nunavut back in 2003. The footage was used for the show, and the animals were mounted.

All have been confiscated and the man and his company have been fined $8,000.

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Shane
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never heard about it
http://www.kruzfm.ca/2014/05/12/muskox-bison-kills-net-man-and-production-company-thousands-in-fines/
slap on the wrists if thats the case
Edited by Shane, May 12 2014, 08:53 PM.
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Heard of it before but I heard it had something too do with the fact that they had drove snowmobiles to close to the head while hunting them.
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Shane
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ah the pressure to produce and please the sponsors gets the best of them i guess
MJewell
May 12 2014, 08:57 PM
Heard of it before but I heard it had something too do with the fact that they had drove snowmobiles to close to the head while hunting them.
lol were the musk ox and buffalo in the same herd?
Edited by Shane, May 12 2014, 09:06 PM.
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Havelock

Never heard of it. But very interesting. And Shane said what I was thinking. Musk Ox and Buffalo travelling together. lol. Would be good to here the whole story to weigh opinions. I Find I watch very few hunting shows these days.
I don't always chase tail, but when I do; its whitetail. Stay camo my friends.
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Shane
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well a 5 year investigation?

two species of wildlife

8000 fine

pleads guilty


not all the facts for sure but obviously illegal activity had taken place and the as far as i know its not against the law to film a hunt so just exactly " the purpose of having video footage for a tv show " dont make sense?
http://www.thealgomanews.ca/news/national/total-of-8000-in-fines-for-unlawful-possession-of-illegally-killed-muskox-and-wood-bison/
" The videos show the defendants being brought to well within 1.5 km of muskox and one km of wood bison by hired guides while being towed in sleds behind snowmobiles. Also, the muskox were herded by the guides using snowmobiles toward Pigeon so that he could more easily select, hunt, shoot and kill the animal of his choosing.
In comparing the commercially produced episodes which are available to the public and were aired on a weekly basis on a national television network, the snowmobiles chasing, herding and controlling the wildlife had been edited from the final production. The final production depicts the hunters as engaged in a fair chase hunt while approaching the animals on foot and then shooting them."
Edited by Shane, May 13 2014, 09:45 AM.
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Renegade
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The courts and press sure didn't give anyone a clue as to the nature of the charges. Can't comment on this except to say who gives a crap about shooting any animal being herded in front of your weapon of choice. That is just shooting. Also, Muskox and Buffalo? Who the hell can relate to hunting those animals? Not very many I would guess.
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This is a new one just out. I suspect it may have been 2 hunts. One for the buffalo and one for the musk ox. Another example of our great TV outdoors stars doing whatever they can/want to make a show (and $$$$)
Below is the whole story reported in the Algoma Paper



Total of $8,000 in Fines for Unlawful Possession of Illegally Killed Muskox and Wood Bison


Publish Date: Monday, 12th of May 2014

by MNR







A five-year investigation has led to a total of $8,000 in fines for a Toronto-area man and his video production company for the unlawful possession of illegally killed muskox and wood bison.
Thomas Pigeon pleaded guilty and was fined $2,000 for unlawfully possessing in Ontario a wood bison that was killed in the Northwest Territories contrary to the laws of that jurisdiction. The video production company, Dancing Buffalo Productions Inc., under the direction of Thomas Pigeon, pleaded guilty and was fined $4,000 and $2,000 respectively for unlawfully possessing in Ontario two muskox and one wood bison that were all killed in Nunavut and the Northwest Territories contrary to the laws of those jurisdictions.
In addition to the fines, the taxidermy mounts of the animals and unedited video tapes of the hunting activities were forfeited to the Crown. All offences were contrary to the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Act, 1997.
The court heard that between March 9, 2003, and April 9, 2003, Thomas Pigeon and others hunted muskox in Nunavut Territory and wood bison in the Northwest Territories. The major purpose of these hunting trips was to obtain video footage of hunting activities in order to use the video footage for a Canadian hunting television show that was at the time produced by Dancing Buffalo Productions Inc. As a result, both hunts were extensively recorded by two professional film crews.
With the assistance of Nunavut and the Northwest Territories Departments of Natural Resources and Environment Canada, investigators with the Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources determined from seized videos that the muskox and wood bison hunts were conducted in violation of the applicable legislation in force at the time of the offences. The Northwest Territories and Nunavut legislation prohibits using a vehicle, motorized toboggan or motorized three-wheeled vehicle to knowingly get within 1.5 km of a muskox or within one km of a wood bison for the purposes of hunting them.
The videos show the defendants being brought to well within 1.5 km of muskox and one km of wood bison by hired guides while being towed in sleds behind snowmobiles. Also, the muskox were herded by the guides using snowmobiles toward Pigeon so that he could more easily select, hunt, shoot and kill the animal of his choosing.
In comparing the commercially produced episodes which are available to the public and were aired on a weekly basis on a national television network, the snowmobiles chasing, herding and controlling the wildlife had been edited from the final production. The final production depicts the hunters as engaged in a fair chase hunt while approaching the animals on foot and then shooting them.
The taxidermy mounts of the animals were possessed in Ontario by the defendants continuously
until they were seized by Ontario conservation officers in April 2011.
Justice of the Peace Denis Lee heard the case in the Ontario Court of Justice, Milton, on May 2,
2014.
The Fish and Wildlife Conservation Act authorizes Ontario investigators to deal with the unlawful
possession of fish and wildlife that have been killed, captured, taken, possessed, transported,
bought or sold contrary to the laws of another jurisdiction. Subsequent possession in Ontario of
such unlawfully obtained fish and wildlife is an offence.
Edited by reddfoxx, May 13 2014, 06:57 PM.
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Shane
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almost sounds like the footage they had on there cameras is what proved the illegal activity
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Well this is another douche Im never going to watch on TV. Im not sure if he is still part of Canada in the Rough but I hope the Beasleys step up and kick him out (I have a lot of respect for Beasleys) Ive hunted with a few guys who have hunted both musk ox and bison. They all said its a weird hunt and you have to stalk into herd and kill the dominant animal within shot. I know its a different hunt but to have them herded towards you with sleds is crazy. This is an easy hunt and they poached these animals as they plead guilty. Another Ontario Poacher. Just like Mr. Smith. IMHO
Edited by ONbuckhunter, May 13 2014, 08:38 PM.
I don't always chase tail, but when I do; its whitetail. Stay camo my friends.
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Shane
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well it sure seems this is a problem in the industry, every time you turn around some high profile hunter get charged?

cant imagine having wildlife drove to you on snow mobiles and then after the animal is down make fake footage of the stalk ? pathetic to say the least and these people are to be looked up to and are setting examples and role models and listened to at seminars?

and to anyone that thinks " well you know hes a nice guy and made a mistake and deserves a second chance blah blah blah " give your head a shake
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Renegade
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Shane
May 13 2014, 09:20 PM
well it sure seems this is a problem in the industry, every time you turn around some high profile hunter get charged?

cant imagine having wildlife drove to you on snow mobiles and then after the animal is down make fake footage of the stalk ? pathetic to say the least and these people are to be looked up to and are setting examples and role models and listened to at seminars?

and to anyone that thinks " well you know hes a nice guy and made a mistake and deserves a second chance blah blah blah " give your head a shake
That is what get's under my skin too Shane. I don't watch outdoor shows very much, don't subscribe to very many magazines anymore and don't miss it. I don't see other hunters and fisherman as celebrities. Hunting is something we enjoy for different reasons. I don't begrudge those who make a living from the "industry" but it is sad that so many that have sought to be in the public eye have been exposed as poachers and people with big ego's and little in the way of integrity and character. I think we sometimes need to evaluate the reasons why we hunt and stive to grasp the purity of the endeavor. My wife's brother and his daughter have been getting into hunting and have expressed an interest to come deer hunting with me and Deb next fall. He harvested his first bear last fall and it was probably 600lbs plus. He took every scrap of meat off that bear. Not even a teaspoon of meat left and he discarded the skull which I informed him was likely well into B&C but he don't care about that. He recently ate squirrel for the first time and wants to try other meats. You kill it you eat it. If you hunt for the kill and not so much for putting food on the table, fine, but at least make the hunt challenging and in a fair chase setting. IMHO
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Shane
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It's fake enough as it is and everybody knows it. You don't film the animal then show the hunter then show the animal then show the hunter cluck the safety off then show the animal again etc. as if a deer or bear wouldn't catch all that movement. Plain and simple once the animal is in sight the camera never comes off it. The rest is sraged after the shot.
That we all know and can understand

But to have animals chased and drove your way with motorized vehicles and shot is one thing but to then stage a fake stalk and let on the skills required is a bit much for me . So much self heroic garbage and what kind of a man needs to fill his ego this way ? And we're all supposed to be in great aw and praise this man for his accomplishments ? Not me sorry. If you ask me this was a common method that was used as a last ditch effort to get the precious footage needed and finally caught up with him . Or is this another case of the first time ever doing it and didn't fully understand the laws ?
Christ we have guys putting horns on deer and posing with them and saying they killed them and that they use this kind of bow and this kinda camo and then hunters go to there seminars to learn something and get there autograph ? And fools suck that crap right up
Edited by Shane, May 13 2014, 09:59 PM.
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Shane
May 13 2014, 09:55 PM
It's fake enough as it is and everybody knows it. You don't film the animal then show the hunter then show the animal then show the hunter cluck the safety off then show the animal again etc. as if a deer or bear wouldn't catch all that movement. Plain and simple once the animal is in sight the camera never comes off it. The rest is sraged after the shot.
That we all know and can understand

But to have animals chased and drove your way with motorized vehicles and shot is one thing but to then stage a fake stalk and let on the skills required is a bit much for me . So much self heroic garbage and what kind of a man needs to fill his ego this way ? And we're all supposed to be in great aw and praise this man for his accomplishments ? Not me sorry. If you ask me this was a common method that was used as a last ditch effort to get the precious footage needed and finally caught up with him . Or is this another case of the first time ever doing it and didn't fully understand the laws ?
Christ we have guys putting horns on deer and posing with them and saying they killed them and that they use this kind of bow and this kinda camo and then hunters go to there seminars to learn something and get there autograph ? And fools suck that crap right up
:cheers: I agree
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baydog
May 14 2014, 05:38 AM
Shane
May 13 2014, 09:55 PM
It's fake enough as it is and everybody knows it. You don't film the animal then show the hunter then show the animal then show the hunter cluck the safety off then show the animal again etc. as if a deer or bear wouldn't catch all that movement. Plain and simple once the animal is in sight the camera never comes off it. The rest is sraged after the shot.
That we all know and can understand

But to have animals chased and drove your way with motorized vehicles and shot is one thing but to then stage a fake stalk and let on the skills required is a bit much for me . So much self heroic garbage and what kind of a man needs to fill his ego this way ? And we're all supposed to be in great aw and praise this man for his accomplishments ? Not me sorry. If you ask me this was a common method that was used as a last ditch effort to get the precious footage needed and finally caught up with him . Or is this another case of the first time ever doing it and didn't fully understand the laws ?
Christ we have guys putting horns on deer and posing with them and saying they killed them and that they use this kind of bow and this kinda camo and then hunters go to there seminars to learn something and get there autograph ? And fools suck that crap right up
:cheers: I agree
Absolutely. I fish bass tournaments and mingle with folks that have egos so high but when push comes to shove they suck it up after weigh in. Hunting is harder as there are no witnesses. I enjoy hunting shows that show the whole story but unfortunately there are few.
I don't always chase tail, but when I do; its whitetail. Stay camo my friends.
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Shane
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Hunting for free with the best outfitters out there in the best places in the country and still gotta break laws ? How much more help do these " professional hunters " need to score on game ? Why not just fly them around in a helicopter and shoot , then stage it all on how all the products they use was such a big factor in there success. These guys that get caught are stained forever in my eyes and it looks good on them
On CBC site now. And I see Thomas not getting great reviews at ood

http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/#!/content/1.2641494
Edited by Shane, May 14 2014, 01:03 PM.
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Shane
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Topics going pretty good on the Alberta forum

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?p=2435689
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It's stunts lake this that turn me off of hunting shows. I would prefer to watch a honest and hard working guy miss a shot on a spike buck then watch these staged hunts where the hosts are more akin to actors than hunters. After this BS, Mr. Pigeon is going to find it hard getting work. Once your reputation is tarnished, it's almost impossible to regain your credibility.

Sam
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Partikle
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This stinks. Now we will hear how it was an honest mistake, an oversight, he is always an ethical hunter but this one time he didn't see that one reg in the bag of the rule book.
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Shane
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Partikle
May 20 2014, 07:56 AM
This stinks. Now we will hear how it was an honest mistake, an oversight, he is always an ethical hunter but this one time he didn't see that one reg in the bag of the rule book.
One time ? It was a wood bison hunt and also a muskox hunt. Two separate hunts in two different locations I believe
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Partikle
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Shane
May 20 2014, 09:33 AM
Partikle
May 20 2014, 07:56 AM
This stinks. Now we will hear how it was an honest mistake, an oversight, he is always an ethical hunter but this one time he didn't see that one reg in the bag of the rule book.
One time ? It was a wood bison hunt and also a muskox hunt. Two separate hunts in two different locations I believe
Exactly.

The whiners will say give him a break, another chance, he's paid his debt to society with a fine.

Meanwhile, the anti's are getting more ammunition and you and I are getting a bad name in the public's perception about hunters.
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Shane
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Over at ood it's a hot topic. People saying what they feel. Couple idiots there that seem to show sympathy for pigeon ? Guess there the ones that got his autograph at one time
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i can't post there but have been watching as well been banned it appears that some guy posted about mario and as soon as they did that the whole thread has been deleted ... wow favortisim
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Shane
May 21 2014, 07:31 PM
Over at ood it's a hot topic. People saying what they feel. Couple idiots there that seem to show sympathy for pigeon ? Guess there the ones that got his autograph at one time
lol))) lol)))
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Posted Image warningshot
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I wonder how dodge, excalibur and sako feel about thir products being used to poach on tv shows, got rid of wld tv as there was lots of fenced deer etc, on their shows and some hunts didnt feel right and g tired of a guys shooting buck after buck after buck and then donating the meat to food bank, yeah right
Edited by warningshot, May 24 2014, 12:08 AM.
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Shane
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Well I've never me thomas pigeon but he put a sour taste in my mouth back in 2007. Don't know if anyone remembers when Tuxburry sold a big calander featuring a free hunt or fishing trip for each month . They got ahold of me to let me know of this huge opportunity to be featured on this calander and really get my name out there . After talking with them several times I donated a hunt for two for a deer hunt ( which was featured as November ) and also a bear hunt for two ( which was featured as August ) according to them this was going to be the biggest thing out there and would be a shame to miss out.

So each month featured a different hunt or fishing trip , on one side was info about the outfitter who was providing the hunt , then a big pic and on the other side was hunting tips about the hunt. Then under that was the calander (was a huge calander )
So I gave my info about myself for each hunt and emailed pics. Then had to provide tips for hunting the deer and bear .

Then they called me one day and said they had exciting news that Thomas wanted to hunt with me sometime . I told them I wasn't interested , the guy couldn't believe I declined the offer of having Canada in the rough hunt with me . I explained that citr had a Canadian audience and it wouldn't help me out at all , and that I needed an American audience ( like the calander was supposed to have )

So later when we were making sure he had all the info he needed from me as there was a dead line so they could start printing , he said he had my info and the pics and I said " and I emailed you the tips " he said oh ya for the bear hunt thomas wanted to write the tips ?

So thomas had a full page ad for citr plus out of all the 12 months everyone who donated the trip wrote there own tips but on the bear hunt I provided there was a pic of Thomas with a bear and his tips ( on my page ) saying. " bear hunting tips written by Thomas pigeon , host and executive producer of Canada in the rough "

The whole thing was a joke , all 12 winners were from Ontario , I don't think it was even seen by any other province or the USA .

But to be host of a national tv show and still feel the need to squeeze in and write tips and get his pic put on my page seemed like there was a ego and desperation for attention on his part .

And now he has been charged on two different hunts in 2003 ? I wonder what kind of tips he could pass on to us all on how to hunt wood bison and muskox ?
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Renegade
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Shane
May 24 2014, 07:37 AM
Well I've never me thomas pigeon but he put a sour taste in my mouth back in 2007. Don't know if anyone remembers when Tuxburry sold a big calander featuring a free hunt or fishing trip for each month . They got ahold of me to let me know of this huge opportunity to be featured on this calander and really get my name out there . After talking with them several times I donated a hunt for two for a deer hunt ( which was featured as November ) and also a bear hunt for two ( which was featured as August ) according to them this was going to be the biggest thing out there and would be a shame to miss out.

So each month featured a different hunt or fishing trip , on one side was info about the outfitter who was providing the hunt , then a big pic and on the other side was hunting tips about the hunt. Then under that was the calander (was a huge calander )
So I gave my info about myself for each hunt and emailed pics. Then had to provide tips for hunting the deer and bear .

Then they called me one day and said they had exciting news that Thomas wanted to hunt with me sometime . I told them I wasn't interested , the guy couldn't believe I declined the offer of having Canada in the rough hunt with me . I explained that citr had a Canadian audience and it wouldn't help me out at all , and that I needed an American audience ( like the calander was supposed to have )

So later when we were making sure he had all the info he needed from me as there was a dead line so they could start printing , he said he had my info and the pics and I said " and I emailed you the tips " he said oh ya for the bear hunt thomas wanted to write the tips ?

So thomas had a full page ad for citr plus out of all the 12 months everyone who donated the trip wrote there own tips but on the bear hunt I provided there was a pic of Thomas with a bear and his tips ( on my page ) saying. " bear hunting tips written by Thomas pigeon , host and executive producer of Canada in the rough "

The whole thing was a joke , all 12 winners were from Ontario , I don't think it was even seen by any other province or the USA .

But to be host of a national tv show and still feel the need to squeeze in and write tips and get his pic put on my page seemed like there was a ego and desperation for attention on his part .

And now he has been charged on two different hunts in 2003 ? I wonder what kind of tips he could pass on to us all on how to hunt wood bison and muskox ?
I remember talking to you about that when this happened. What a joke. That right there gives you a good idea about what Thomas Pigeon was all about and his sense of entitlement and need to stroke his ego.
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warningshot
May 24 2014, 12:06 AM
I wonder how dodge, excalibur and sako feel about thir products being used to poach on tv shows, got rid of wld tv as there was lots of fenced deer etc, on their shows and some hunts didnt feel right and g tired of a guys shooting buck after buck after buck and then donating the meat to food bank, yeah right
Apparently Bill T from Excalibur is of the If you can't beat em, join them crowd....

Found the below article on the Sault paper site. Wonder what happened here and what show they were hunting with?
Fines and Forfeitures For Transport and Possession of Illegally Killed Muskox

Publish Date: Wednesday, 5th of September 2012
by M.N.R.


Following a multi-agency, inter-provincial investigation, two Ontariomen have been fined a total of $5,500 for the transport and possession of illegally killed muskoxen.
William Troubridge, of Elora, pleaded guilty and was fined $4,000 for unlawfully transporting from Nunavut to Ontariotwo muskoxen that were killed contrary to Nunavutlegislation, thereby committing an offence contrary to the Wild Animal and Plant Protection and Regulation of International and Interprovincial Trade Act.
Roger Davidson, of Stouffville, also pleaded guilty and was fined a total of $1,500 for unlawfully possessing in Ontarioa muskox that was killed, transported and removed from Nunavutcontrary to the laws of that jurisdiction thereby committing an offence contrary to the Fish and Wildlife Conservation Act, 1997.
The limitation period had expired in Nunavutfor any charges for the unlawful killing of the muskoxen. In addition to the fines, the taxidermy mounts of the muskoxen were forfeited to the Crown.
The courts heard that in April of 2005, William Troubridge and Roger Davidson were involved in hunts for muskox on Victoria Island, Nunavut. Video of the hunts was being taken for a Canadian hunting television show. Following information provided to the Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources, a search warrant was obtained and the raw video footage of these hunts was seized from a video production facility in Ontario. Investigators from the Ministry of Natural Resources, Environment Canada's Enforcement Branch (Ontario Region) and the Government of Nunavut Department of Environment determined from the videos that the muskox hunts were conducted in violation of Nunavutwildlife legislation in force at the time of the offences. TheNunavutlegislation prohibits using a vehicle, motorized toboggan or motorized three-wheeled vehicle to knowingly get within 1.5 kilometres of a muskox for the purposes of hunting the muskox.
The videos show the men being brought to well within 1.5 km of muskoxen so they could more easily select, hunt, shoot and kill the muskox of their choosing. In the case of Troubridge, the video shows that, with his full knowledge, muskoxen were herded by guides on snowmobiles toward him.
The three muskoxen were shipped to Ontario where taxidermy was performed on all the animals so they could be displayed as trophies.
Justice of the Peace Arthur Child heard Troubridge’s case in the Ontario Court of Justice, Guelph, on June 5, 2012. Justice of the Peace Allison Forestall heard Davidson’s case in the Ontario Court of Justice, Cobourg, on June 20, 2012.
To report a natural resources violation, call 1-877-TIPS-MNR (847-7667) toll-free any time or contact your local ministry office during regular business hours. You can also call Crime Stoppers anonymously at 1-800-222-TIPS (8477). [/QUOTE]

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Shane
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The sad thing is there is so much of this poaching going its seems almost accepted by some hunters depending who's is charged with the offence . If its some joe blow that nobody knows he is a piece of crap and they should throw the book at him , if its someone on a tv show it shouldn't be talked about ?
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Shane
Jun 8 2014, 10:59 AM
The sad thing is there is so much of this poaching going its seems almost accepted by some hunters depending who's is charged with the offence . If its some joe blow that nobody knows he is a piece of crap and they should throw the book at him , if its someone on a tv show it shouldn't be talked about ?
Shane,Who is saying that it should not be talked about? I think everybody on this site agree that if someone breaks the rules, poaches, that they should throw the book at them. I also think ever one agrees that the, fines punishment are never enough.
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"A peculiar virtue in wildlife ethics is that the hunter has no gallery to applaud or disapprove his conduct. Whatever his acts, they are dictated by his own conscience, rather than onlookers. It is difficult to exaggerate the importantance of this fact."                                      Aldo Leopold
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Shane
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I'm just going by all the past poaching threads we have ever had on here muskoka .
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