| Welcome to Whip Ass Gaming Forums! You're currently viewing the forums as a guest. The only limitation on guests, here at WAG Forums, is that you simply cannot contribute posts/pics/whatever. You can view all forums, all pics, all member profiles, everything. If you're just here to lurk, feel free continuing to do so...there is no reason to sign up for an account. However, if you would like to contribute then go ahead and start the registration process! Join our community! NOTE: I have no idea why the board defaults to centering everything when you're lurking/not logged in. Once logged in, it aligns everything to the left(as it should be). If you're already a member...log in: |
| New Ati AGP cards; And the headaches that come with them | |
|---|---|
| Topic Started: May 24 2009, 01:25 PM (158 Views) | |
| sheath | May 24 2009, 01:25 PM Post #1 |
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
Well I found out the hard way yesterday that Ati does not officially support the new AGP video cards that have been coming out since last year. By not support, I mean they don't bother to list the AGP versions of their HD 3000+ series cards in the latest catalyst driver sets. I thought I would post about this before anybody else gets suckered into buying one of these cards. If you're expecting to prolong their system's life by adding support for the latest drivers, and thereby the latest games you will have to be able to do the following upon installing your new HD series AGP card. Only Sapphire and Powercolor produced the HD 3850 AGP, and it appears that Sapphire does a *much* better job of "hotfixing" the latest AGP drivers in a timely manner. Powercolor on the other hand hasn't updated their drivers since October of last year, whereas Ati has posted several revisions this year alone. So, here is what you have to do to "hotfix" the latest catalyst drivers, it is simple enough now that I know how to do it, but as there was a dearth of information online I thought I would spell it out. Also, it's generally a good idea to completely uninstall previous versions of CCC from Control Panel and then use a driver clean utility such as Driver Sweeper from Guru 3D prior to attempting any of this. I got most of this information from the AMD Forums but the threads assumed I knew a whole lot than I did at first. To install the latest CCC from Ati's website you need to do the following for Sapphire and Powercolor HD 3850 cards. 1) With the card installed run regedit and go to: HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Enum\PCI Find VEN_1002 It may be something like VEN_1002&DEV_9515&SUBSYS_0028174B&REV_00 Right click and copy the key name You will only need the part after after VEN_1002&DEV_ ... and before ... &REV_00 For Saphire HD 3850 it should be 9515&SUBSYS_0028174B For Powercolor HD 3850 it should be: 9515&SUBSYS_00281787 2) Next, or before if you like, run the latest CCC executable, to date this should be "9-5_xp32_dd_ccc_wdm_enu.exe". It should error out for you, right after you agree to the terms, saying that you don't have a compatible vid card for the drivers or some such. That's fine, because the exe dumped its guts all over your C: drive in the process. 3) Navigate to C:\ATI\SUPPORT\9-5_xp32_dd_ccc_wdm_enu\Driver\Driver\XP_INF and Open CX_80257.inf with notepad. If using this tutorial for a later driver release, it should be the only INF file in the XP_INF folder. In Notepad click on Edit and Find 3850 The frist one you find should be "ATI Radeon HD 3850" = ati2mtag_RV630, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_9505&SUBSYS_25421002 Change "HD 3850" to "HD 3850 AGP" modify 9505&SUBSYS_25421002 to: Sapphire HD 3850: 9515&SUBSYS_0028174B Powercolor HD 3850: 9515&SUBSYS_00281787 Should look like this (example Sapphire) "ATI Radeon HD 3850 AGP" = ati2mtag_RV630, PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_9515&SUBSYS_0028174B Save file and close 4) Two other files need to be modified in like manner, the CX_80257.INI and INSTALL.INI in the previous directory (e.g. C:\ATI\SUPPORT\9-5_xp32_dd_ccc_wdm_enu\Driver\Driver). With notepad find 0x9505:0x25421002 and replace it with: Sapphire: 0x9515:0x0028174B Powercolor: 0x9515:0x00281787 This must be done for both the CX_...INI and INSTALL.INI. That's it! If you've copied what you found in your registry correctly into these three files in the Ati directory that the CCC executable dumped prior to erroring out you should be ready to run the Setup.exe back in "C:\ATI\SUPPORT\9-5_xp32_dd_ccc_wdm_enu\Driver" and actually succeed in installing your newest Catalyst Control Center and Catalyst Driver. Just be sure that you *replaced* all three segments in the files listed above, if you duplicate the entries and modify the new lines the driver will still return an error. You are actually replacing the PCIe key with the correct key for the AGP cards. |
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
 |
 
|
| Belpowerslave | May 24 2009, 02:39 PM Post #2 |
Administrator
|
From what I've read, there is an ATI AGP Driver Fix patch out that you need to install before adding the card to your system. From there the system and drivers will see the AGP card and thus will install everything properly. It's talked about here: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131141 and here: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102730 (in the comments of both) What I'd guess is going to happen is that we'll start seeing apps like Mobility Modder, which allows you to update your video drivers on laptops with integrated graphics cards, of which ATI/Nvidia do not detect and won't install for. Just give it some time...it'll get better. Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| sheath | May 24 2009, 03:06 PM Post #3 |
|
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
The hotfix is a later release for each CCC that is released. So, since 9.4 completely broke the Component output on my card, and that was the last version hotfixed by Ati, I was stuck with attempting to fix the latest version for myself. This way I can update my drivers without waiting to see if Ati will get around to doing it for me. So far the latest drivers are as functional as the ones that came with the card for watching HD MKVs. I'll need to check some games in MAME and whatnot to see if they improve anything else. |
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
|
|
|
| David J. | Jun 12 2009, 10:51 PM Post #4 |
|
The other pallet swapped ninja
|
What was the last AGP card that ATi made themselves/still support? Was it the Radeon X1XXX series? |
|
|
|
| sheath | Jun 13 2009, 06:23 AM Post #5 |
|
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
I believe so. The HD 3850 requires a 650W PSU, but it does have "hotfix" drivers up to the latest Catalyst on the Ati page. The hitch is having to wait for the hotfix for the next release if you're pining for a new game to be fixed. Also, the "hotfix it yourself" method I described above doesn't work in XP 64. I haven't figured out what to do there, but the 9.2 Catalyst drivers run everything beautifully anyway. CoD 4 and Crysis ran at full specs with hardly a hickup. It's too bad that Alone in the Dark seems hopelessly flawed, as I can't get that thing to stop taking ten minutes to load the game from the desktop.
Edited by sheath, Jun 13 2009, 06:33 AM.
|
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Jun 23 2009, 10:47 AM Post #6 |
|
Administrator
|
If you ever find someone who is hacking the ATI drivers so that they will work on lower-end cards that ATI has discontinued, let me know. I use this program on my laptop, called "Mobility Modder", that modifies that ATI driver set so that it can be installed when you have a video card in your laptop. If you try this without modding them, the ATI installer will simply tell you that it doesn't detect any compatible devices and then quit. I am hoping something like this comes out for the desktop cards as a LOT of people are pissed off that ATI has dropped support for everything but the "HD" line of cards(and even at that, they don't support the AGP versions). Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Sep 27 2009, 01:39 AM Post #7 |
|
Administrator
|
Just wanted to let you know that ATI has updated their "Legacy" drivers for older card to 9.8...just once month behind the others. Before that we were stuck at 9.3...then 9.3.1 came out. All in all, not too bad for a series of cards that are no longer supported. If ATI keeps releasing a "Legacy" driver set every 3 to 5 months, I could live with that... I am *praying* that this fixes the freezing(no pun intended) issues I am having with Lost Planet Colonies Ed. I don't know what the deal is, but I've had it freeze the *entire* PC up three or four times now. Not sure what to make of it, as it doesn't seem to do it with any real regularity. I defragged the install files, I've tried to take it easy whenever it loads more of a level, etc...I am out of ideas. Sucks too, because I am absolutely LOVING this fucking game! I'm serious, I find this to be even better than Gears of War. Man, with part 2 having co-op built in...I cannot wait! The nice thing is that since it's Capcom, we *know* it's going to hit PC...unlike Halo 3 and ODST(MS) and Gears of War 2(Epic)... Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| sheath | Oct 2 2009, 07:36 AM Post #8 |
|
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
I just installed the CCC 9.9 AGP hotfix drivers. After getting a flipping screen and having to go back to 9.2, which didn't solve it, I cleared all of my drivers with driversweeper in safe mode. After that the 9.9 AGP drivers installed fine, I can even set the desktop resolution to 1920x1080 and after blowing up the text I can browse the web and navigate Windows Explorer fine. I then installed K-lite 5.10 and made sure that H.264 encoded video was run by ffdshow. K-lite has an upgrade to 5.16 available, which I also installed, it updated ffdshow and adds some helpful tools. The result: 1080p movies now play flawlessly on the Athlon 64 single core Mamebox with 2GB of RAM. So far I've only got Transformers the Movie (the original), and Transformers Rolling on the Floor, I mean Revenge of the Fallen. Even hooked up to my 40inch Rear Projection TV I can tell the difference between 1080 and 720 video. I'm going to go for the full 11GB rip from now on. So, AGP Ati cards past the HD3000 series work great, I highly recommend them. |
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Oct 2 2009, 01:47 PM Post #9 |
|
Administrator
|
I gotta kind of ask: Why bother with the newer drivers that aren't part of the Legacy updates? I thought it said: "All future ATI Catalyst releases made available past the ATI Catalyst 9.8 release will not include support for the legacy products listed above or any of the features associated with those legacy products." Wouldn't this make it redundant to update past what they release for our "legacy" cards?
Yeah, in terms of Blu-Ray rips, just download what you keep your screen res at. Like you, I use 1280X720 on my HDTV when viewing stuff on my HTPC...so when I grabbed the Watchmen Blu-Ray rip, I grabbed the 8 gig 720p version...not the 15+ gig 1080 version as I didn't need the extra res. This helps on disc space usage as well as download time...which is always a good thing. For the most part I buy movies on DVD still, and then go out and download the Blu-Ray version. Though it's still stealing, I don't feel nearly as bad about it as I do actually own a version of the product. I also feel really good about buying the DVD version of the product, instead of the Blu-Ray version...then jacking the Blu-Ray one off the net because it hurts the BDA in a double whammy: It increases DVD sales numbers while lower Blu-Ray numbers, plus I just fucked them out of $30. ;) Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| sheath | Oct 11 2009, 02:30 PM Post #10 |
|
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
Sorry, I missed this one, but we're all waiting a week or two to reply now anyway. ;)
The 9.2 drivers forced me to stay at 1280x720 resolution because I couldn't read the text at 1920x1080 for one thing. Newer catalyst drivers in 32-bit XP gave me serious, and documented, problems with component output. I'm not sure what features aren't supported, but literally everything runs better for me with the HD3850 AGP using the 9.9 CCC drivers.
The 1080 downloads are worth the extra space for me. The three that I've done so far downloaded faster than the 720 downgrades because they're more popular. I don't know if it's because of the RPTV's inherent blur or what, but I cannot really tell the benefit between the 720p Bluray rips and the DVD playing with "black level enhancement" on my 360's HD-DVD drive. There is a difference in some background elements, but everything that is in focus looks pretty much the same on my set. The jump to 1080p resolution requires the jump to 1920x1080 on the desktop and seriously current drivers and codecs for a single core system. I can tell the difference in the video and the audio in these rips and I like those differences quite a bit. Audio seems to suffer in particular for the 720p downgraded rips. |
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Nov 3 2009, 12:34 PM Post #11 |
|
Administrator
|
To me, it's not that I don't want to reply so much as it's hard to get the energy to do so...and then it starts stacking up so quickly, so I've got, like, 20 or 30 things to reply to by the time I finally find the time/energy. I feel bad...and I don't mean this to come off the way it most likely will, but if I'm not around to stimulate the forum it seems like we just stagnate...so there's a bit of pressure on me to get my ass on here(plus, just due to the fact that it is my forum, and I *should* be leading it).
A little trick Wang taught me, after setting me up with my HTPC: If you go in to the Display Properties, then hit the last tab, then "Advanced". On the first tab, General, there is a drop down box that will probably read "96dpi", hit "Custom Setting" and drag it to around 110%, see what you think. From there you can raise or lower it, and this will increase all font sizes for the machine. There is a downside though: Stuff on the net can look significantly different than it really should do to this, but as long as you're not developing on your HTPC, you should be alright.
For me, it's all about making them fit on a dual layer DVD. All six Star Wars films I have, in WMV-HD format, are around 8.something gigs and all fit on a dual layer disc(six discs in total). From there I can just simply pop them in the 360 or PC and watch them...while still owning the regular DVD versions for the extras and whatnot. Downloading a 720p Dark Knight WMV-HD rip right now, it'll fit on a dual layer disc as well. Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| David J. | Nov 3 2009, 03:58 PM Post #12 |
|
The other pallet swapped ninja
|
Hey Bel, is that from the latest drivers? I am building a new PC that is getting hooked up to the HDTV and I hated being stuck at some odd res like 1378x768 or some bs like that... 1920x1080 looked like ass. Will try and hook it up to the TV :D |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Nov 3 2009, 09:44 PM Post #13 |
|
Administrator
|
I don't know why you'd hate being stuck at some odd res, especially when it fits your screen better. Though my TV can do 720p, for some reason when the HTPC outputs it, it's just simply bigger than the screen, so I use 1152X648. Works better, fits perfectly, I see absolutely no issues when viewing 720p material on it. 1080p on anything less than a 50 or 60 inch TV is horrible...it's just makes text too fucking small to even think about reading. Now, using Wang's method above, you can get it to a reasonable level, but for my money, 720p res is good enough. Then again, you've got to realize this is coming from someone who will deck anyone who sits there and turns their nose at 1080i because it's not "full HD". ;) That Dark Knight, 6.44GB, 720p WMV-HD file finished tonight and I watched through it. I've gotta say, for a rip that small it is absolutely amazing quality. Contains 6 audio channels and sounded great. Burning it to a dual layer DVD right now, for future playback in either the 360 or the HTPC. If you find the torrent for it, I highly recommend it. Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| David J. | Nov 3 2009, 10:08 PM Post #14 |
|
The other pallet swapped ninja
|
It did fits my screen better... if not perfect, but it's a low ass res and this was my MAIN PC. I now have a 23.6 inch ASUS 1080p pc monitor, and it's nice. This new PC is going hooked up to the TV anyway once it gets built. |
|
|
|
| sheath | Nov 4 2009, 07:18 AM Post #15 |
|
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
Well, you know, I try to keep it going. The problem is when I use the forums to post about updates on my website I'm too lazy to cut and paste the update into my own updates page.
Yeah, I've been using 120% at 1920x1080. Everything fits the screen perfectly with the newest Catalyst drivers. Before I was forced to create a custom resolution using Powerstrip of 1120x680 and I still had to slightly increase the font dpi to be able to read desktop icons and menus. At this much lower resolution on the 40inch widescreen RPTV I really could not tell the difference between 720p rips and DVDs.
That really isn't a bad idea, I'd really like to take my Dark Knight DVD insert and put it in one of the extra HD-DVD cases I bought last year, slap the WMV-HD dual layer DVD in there and light scribe the top and I'd be very happy with that sitting on the shelf. |
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Nov 8 2009, 02:41 PM Post #16 |
|
Administrator
|
Yeah, I know, and I appreciate it. :)
It all goes back to to that "time and effort" thing I was talking about...seems like once I expend the effort here, like you, I don't have any effort for anything else. Hell, I've even used posts here for my Examiner articles, modified and extended a bit mind you...
I guess it depends on the disc...even with that Reon chip inside my player I can still tell the difference between HD DVD and regular DVD most of the time. There are some exceptions, like those extended versions of the Lord of the Ring movies(the ones that come in the book-like cases)...those things look HD when upscaled. Grimshade and I went through all three on my old upscaling DVD player and the picture was incredible...I can't wait to see it through the Reon chip.
That's what I do...I have all six of my Star Wars WMV-HD discs in HD DVD cases(they sell them at Fry's as "Next Generation Media Cases"), just need to print out a label at some point. The Dark Knight will be joining them. Wish my Watchmen BD rip would fit on DVD-DL, it's only 7.95 gig...but for some reason it still won't fit. I don't mind keeping it on the HDD, but any time I can burn 8 gigs on to a disc, I will. Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| Belpowerslave | Nov 20 2009, 05:13 PM Post #17 |
|
Administrator
|
The new ATI drivers for our cards are out now: 9.11! That's right on track with the new, new ones! Not too shabby! The install is now a lot different(when you run it with newer cards only)...pretty wild. Bel |
|
Whip Ass Gaming Dallas Classic Game Examiner | |
|
|
|
| sheath | Yesterday, 8:59 PM Post #18 |
|
Apollyon of the Wicker People
|
I just tried to install them in XP 32-bit on the Mamebox and failed miserably. It looks like I'm up for another 12 rounds of uninstalling and re-installing to get that driver working again. The good news will be that I will be able to have both XP 32 and XP 64 running on the same drivers, which will be nice for when I want to boot to either so I won't need restart before watching movies and whatnot. |
|
www.gamepilgrimage.com Currently wondering where the hell everybody has gone. | |
|
|
|
| « Previous Topic · Dirt-Cheap PC Gaming · Next Topic » |
12:41 AM Nov 26
