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Using a manticore
Topic Started: May 16 2014, 03:09 PM (1,561 Views)
The Randy Halfling
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Troll's Play Thing
I need help using a manticore. I want opinions on the best way to use this suboptimal mount. I can use this for a lord or sorcerer, as I can fit in a lvl 2 if needed (I run throgg and a BSB in every list). Any and all input would be appreciated. I usually play at 2500 points so you can use up to 625 points on this guy (though I think about 620 is the max possible). Thanks!
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Urian
Warrior of the Chamber
I would use it for a mobile sorcerer lord. The manti gives it some punch, especially against fastcav/chaff. As long as the manti lives, the sorcerer won't need protection from light troops. Maybe Death lore and cast Vortex sideways across an opponents battleline.

Also the manti gives some kind of protection from shooting as hits will be divided between rider and mount. T5 and 4+AS (if paid for) can survive some light shooting.
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Jdo
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Exalted Guardian
maybe lord of tz + armour of destiny + MR3 + ironcourse icon + scaled skin + halberd +3rd eye+ solu/breath
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Tremendous
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Exalted Guardian
Nothing you're going to give the character is going to help this mount. With, at best, a 4+ AS he's not going to last long in your games. He can WAY to easily be shot out from under you with just basic shooting. It's the same reason people don't take a Slaughterbrute. (Well one of the reasons)

Plus, with the rage test you've got to take if you fail the frenzy check you'll be charging into combat where a smart opponent is just going to kill the manticore out from under you and leave your lord standing alone against a sea of combat Resolution.

I would not take him, but if you're determined, I would suggest:
Chaos Lord
Crown of Command(For when you lose the Manticore in CC)
Talisman of Endurance
Halberd
Dragon Helm
Scaled Skin
Soul Feeder

Basically I'd kit him out like a solo lord on foot. Cause that's what he's going to be most of the game.

Hope this helps!

:)
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Jofarin
Clanlord
Tremendous
May 16 2014, 08:07 PM
Nothing you're going to give the character is going to help this mount.
Is this rule? Because I'd say MR gives the manticore a ward save against spells as well as the ironcurse icon gives him a 6+ against warmachines.
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NoisyAssassin
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The Chosen
Yes, any item that affects the character's unit (such as MR or Ironcurse) will affect the mount. However, that won't save teh poor Manti for long :/
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Vantraxx
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The Thrice Cursed
Ironcurse icon is a great idea i never thought of. Good tip. I know it's not great but it is something. I do usually have the icon in a more worthy unit but old Manti needs all the help he can get.
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Berghofer
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The Undivided
I am also building a manticore lord for an upcomming campaign, and I have fast come to accept, that unless I have a bigger monster-thread on the table (I have a Hellcannon, but I can't plan for my opponents being.. well, optimistic, enough to targetting that if he asks me for it's rules), the manticore is going to die fast.
I'm not really worried about the Manticores "Uncontrollable" rule though, as you FIRST have to fail the LD check to see IF you have frenzy for that turn, and IF you have, THEN you'd have to fail another LD check to have to charge something. With LD 9, it is a 1/36 chance that you are forced to charge (it is the same chance that a Hellcannon blows up though, so if that happens a lot for you, you should consider this as a possibility as well ;)

As for the best protection, it kind of already starts with some, since it is a ridden monster (5+ "rider" save in form of the chance that a shooting attack will hit the rider (Who I'm not that worried about with my kit of Charmed shield and 4++ (no tzeentch mark, as my infantry units are marked Khorne and Slaanesh, I want him to be able to join either when the Manticore eventually dies)).

Regarding the MR 3, I think it is too much killing power/character defence to give up, to use 45 points on the Obsidian Lodeston, unless you know that you are going up against someone who is relying on magic damage to kill monsters.

I am then deeply troubled by the choice between the Ironcurse Icon, and the crown of command.
The Icon is just a 6++ vs Warmachines ONLY. So massed shooting (perhaps with poison), and CC will still kill it fast, with just a 4+ armour and 5+ "rider" save vs shooting.
And when it dies, as earlier mentioned, the lord will be beaten in combat, and might easely be run down..

So I am Leaning towards the Crown of Command, and just use the manticore as a way of keeping the rest of my army safe from heavy shooting, and get my lord to where I want him to hold stuff up.

But none the less, I am still looking very much forward to fielding the very cool Manticore with Lord miniature :)
Edited by Berghofer, May 17 2014, 02:29 AM.
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GeneralofChaos42
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The Puppet Master
I bet the fun factor is through the roof. Also nice looking model to boot.
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Blackspine
Warrior of the Chamber
yes!

The manticore is amazing. So fun.

I only wish our heroes could take one...

I think the MR3 is too many points to give him a so so ward.
If you run him, cover his *ss with Chimeras. SURROUND HIM so cannons have to go through their regen and wounds and light shooting is at -2 to hit you.

Then you have mobile AIR CAV.

If you really want to go for a sorcerer, i mean REALLY Want, go Tzeentch. 2nd choice is slaanesh .

Tzeentch lets this guy become a Mobile artillery platform. Is he as defensive as a disc? probably not. But you're running a MANTICORE. WHO CARES!? You can run and gun (most of the Tzeentch lore) and then bomb leadership for terror tests with Treason of Tzeentch. if a unit fails their leadership, they're dead meat. You want the chimeras here to do some punch and take some heat off the manticore. many people will try to kill the chimeras so their i2 attacks wont happen. It's fine.

You're late game charging (t3...early, t4-6 most often) with this guy. He does not have the stats to grind. Good thing is with Tzeentch, you can blast most light shooting/ artillery to the ground so you can use this magnificent sonofabeetch.

With slaanesh, you can really up the attacks with frenzy and DESTROY their leadership for charges. Cacophonic is crazy useful here as you can go anywhere near them and just blast it out with 6diceSkill. Word of caution: careful when / where you use it, an enemy could rear charge you with random movement if you're close enough.

if you're running a Manticore* you're running a fast list. You need fast units to take care of shooting and warmachines.

Marauder horsemen (flails)
Slaanesh forsaken
Chariots

maybe even a tzeentch spawn for an unbreakable breathweapon on the cheap.

Keep your BSB nearby, as leadership 8 (sorc lord) is nothing to write home about.

I'd get some RnF infantry nearby so IF you get shot off this fantastic face crusher, you can duck in there.

The manticore is amazing. It's not the most optimal choice, but it's a game. (plus most people are so used to net list, making them react quickly changes games) Have some fun and throw some dice
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Tremendous
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Exalted Guardian
Ok. Let's say, thanks to skill, luck, and some raw awesome, the Manticore gets into glorious Combat. EVEN in a challenge, the manticore is going to be targeted and it's 4+ AS isn't going to help save him from anything courageous enough (Or stupid enough) to accept the challenge. IF you think you're going to get him into combat with full wounds as well, well shoot, you're either a Warhammer Yoda, or your opponent is completely incompetent.

Now I'm not saying don't take him. By all means, if this is something you want in your list then you'd be stupid NOT to take him. :) My point is to kit your rider out like he's on foot so that when your manticore dies (He will... get out of the denial phase) your Lord will be ready for it.

My 2-cents. Hope it helps!

:)
Edited by Tremendous, May 17 2014, 06:46 AM.
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Blackspine
Warrior of the Chamber
Tremendous
May 17 2014, 06:44 AM

My point is to kit your rider out like he's on foot so that when your manticore dies (He will... get out of the denial phase) your Lord will be ready for it.

Exactly.
prepare for the worst.

a 3++ lord with a 3+ as should be fine.

Wit support, he'll make it no problem.
some armies do not pack shooting (beasts, other warriors, some demons)

in a comped environment, you'll be playing other soft(ish) lists and you'll get this bad boy into combats.

or just face double skillcannons...at that point, just have a drink and think of running the Chaos Dragon.
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Speknawz
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Unchosen
Rules to play a Manticore:
1. Apply directly to somethings face.
2. Roll extremely well.
3. ??????
4. PROFIT!!
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Benaiah
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The Chosen
I feel like that's the general rule of thumb for our whole army...
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Jofarin
Clanlord
Benaiah
May 17 2014, 10:53 AM
I feel like that's the general rule of thumb for our whole army...
Yes. Works even for the cannon... (serious)
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