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| Dark Northmen - 2,500 points; Lots of suggestions on trial | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 3 2011, 04:24 AM (636 Views) | |
| Kormak | Nov 12 2011, 01:55 AM Post #16 |
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High Executioner of Khorne
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Personally I think you list could really benefit from a anvil unit, this is also the unit if would hide my sorcerer in, 20 Tzeentch warriors with HW+SH would just be a excellent list to have, having a 3+/5+ save can be just as useful and pumping out attacks. sorcerer lord seems pretty standard, ( I actually prefer having my 3rd eye here), to be perfectly honest with 2 blocks pf warriors and a block of chosen you really don't need a unit of marauders as well, you could easily exchange them for a hellcannon which will add so much more to the list. Don't like the BSB, its to easy to kill him before the chosen attack and remove the frenzy, if you want frenzied chosen just give them MoK. Apart for that it all seems fine, I dunno if you really need both warshrines, would be tempted to drop one for something else. |
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| rothgar13 | Nov 12 2011, 02:02 AM Post #17 |
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Clanlord
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I'm very tempted to drop one for something else as well, but the main reason I have to is to really make sure I have Divine Greatness, because I'm putting plenty of eggs in that Chosen basket, including the BSB. I can definitely get behind some HW/Shield Warriors in this list, actually. Thanks for that one. If the BSB dying before the Chosen get to swing is an issue, I could drop the Great Weapons and go for Halberds instead, and just shoot for the pre-game buff from Chosen of the Dark Gods to be +1S (more reliance on the Warshrines, true, but it does offer a solution to that problem). I'm rather loathe to remove the Marauders, though, mainly because there are still some matchups they cover that HW/Shield or Halberd Warriors can't. Either way, made some edits. How does it look now? Edited by rothgar13, Nov 12 2011, 02:10 AM.
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| Kormak | Nov 12 2011, 03:24 AM Post #18 |
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High Executioner of Khorne
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I tend to go for +1T when using great weapons on chosens, makes them very hard to shift, i still think the BSB is a massive mistake, at best your unit gets 1 round of frenzy, you lose your BSB and give away bonus VPs. |
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| rothgar13 | Nov 12 2011, 03:48 AM Post #19 |
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Clanlord
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How would he die so easily, though? He's going to benefit from Divine Greatness, the same as the other Chosen, because I'm picking it up during the game thanks to the Warshrines (I'm shooting for +1S as my start-of-the-game buff, Divine Greatness as my second buff, and maybe +1T as my third). If I put him in a corner of the unit, a 3+ Ward save and WS7 should take care of the rest, no? My back-of-the-envelope calculations say I have a 90% chance of starting the game with +1S, and then I can just spam Giver of Glory until I get Divine Greatness. Edited by rothgar13, Nov 12 2011, 03:55 AM.
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| Kormak | Nov 12 2011, 04:22 AM Post #20 |
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High Executioner of Khorne
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Your relying on getting it before combat unless you don't expect to be in combat by turn 4, then of course you have the danger of things like lore death of snipping him early on. Truth be told chosen don't need a character with them, they are powerful enough, a unit of chaos warriors would benefit more from him while making the chosen less of a tempting target for things like the dreaded 13th spell. |
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| rothgar13 | Nov 12 2011, 04:45 AM Post #21 |
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Clanlord
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A solid point. My idea behind placing the BSB in there is that I could give the Chosen Frenzy to make their offensive output be as good as it can and should be, and also for protection because the Chosen are a lot harder than the rest of the army. It also helps my Chosen anchor the line, because there's a very good reason to keep them in the middle of everything. Death magic is certainly a concern, especially if I end up going second, but between getting 2 shots at it and our M4, I'm reasonably confident in my odds of getting it before the end of Turn 3, which is just in time for combat in my experience. Edited by rothgar13, Nov 12 2011, 04:50 AM.
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| DarkSchneider | Nov 13 2011, 07:10 AM Post #22 |
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Clanlord
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i think you're going to miss the mar. horsemen and the hellcannon too much. At least try to squeeze the mar. in, dropping some chosen (14 would be good) |
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| conjoy | Nov 17 2011, 08:51 PM Post #23 |
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Exalted Guardian
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I think its a really solid list, regarding the main points being discussed: If you like to be creative in the movement phase and want to be tactically strong MHorse are unbeatable. Ldr 7 (and the Musician means Ldr 8 when rallying from those fled charges) and MoSl is just so much better than Ldr 5. They also add so much utility that they more than justify their points value. I can understand why you are angling for S 6 in combat, but if you really want DGreatness (which you do with the BSB in there) then statistically speaking you really need to go for +1A on the initial roll. Potentially this negates the need for the Banner of Rage. Something you also need to be wary of is redirectors – any unit with Frenzy can be a major liability due to the requirement to pursue/overrun. Which I would consider a major concern on your most expensive and central unit. IMHO, take something like the +1M banner instead may work out more effective. A good player will redirect your Chosen all over the battlefield and it will never see a combat you actually want them to be in. If you are sticking with Frenzy, I would say MHorse are essential to block your overruns as they have the best chance of positioning with the Fast Cav unlimited reforms. Also on the Chosen, I would consider reducing the number. Per the point above, apart from 6-dicing spells, your opponent will be more likely to avoid such a deathstar rather than trying to confront it. If on the other hand it was 12-14 models, it might be a more tempting target for him to actually engage. Why have you got MoKh Warriors with Shields? Frenzy means no Parry and against the prevalent S 5, only a 5+ save. These must be switched to MoTz for 3+5++ in combat. The Iron Curse icon would also be a good investment for these guys on either of your Mages. Potentially you could drop the MoTz off one of your Warshrines if you need points elsewhere. |
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| rothgar13 | Nov 18 2011, 01:57 AM Post #24 |
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Clanlord
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The Khorne bit is a typo. That should be Tzeentch, thanks. I've actually been doing a lot of changes to this list as well, and I think I've found one I'm satisfied with. Not going the Chosen-star route, it eats up too many points. Here's the new one. |
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| Harbinger | Feb 26 2012, 03:59 AM Post #25 |
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The Chosen
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I have to agree with both of you. Running frenzied warriors in 6 wide blocks is great, typically because you can fit all six to fight. I'm also a fan of the idea of running them in a brick of 24. I personally love chaos warriors despite what people may say about them, and im not a fna of the MSU of warriors because they are still very expensive in small groups. My only thing is the shields on the one unit. If you going to give them shields, i wouldn't go with MoK. Sure your armour save is one point better, but i would prefer halberds because these guys need to be killing things. Plus they can't make a parry save since they are frenzied. |
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4:28 PM Jul 11