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New Armybook Wishlisting!; Let's wishlist here
Topic Started: Nov 24 2011, 03:45 PM (1,013 Views)
theorox
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Clanlord
I'm creating this thread as to not clutter the rumourthread. Here's the place for us to wishlist about what we want to see in the new book rumoured Q4 2012 by Hastings on Warseer. Link to rumour thread:

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=324909

Theo
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TheOneHawk
Warrior of the Chamber
Flayerkin. That is all.
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theorox
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Clanlord
Personally I hope the "big kit!" is a Chaos Dragon/Shaggoth kit, Arachnarok sized. Think it could really work. :D

For rules, I'd like something like:

Chaos Lords a bit cheaper.
Marauders to start at 4p and 2+ for GW's/Flails.
Chaos Ogres a bit cheaper.
Chaos Trolls 40p each, minimum unit size 1.
Chaos Spawn becoming Skirmishers in units of 1-3. Also, cheaper.
Giants down to 200p, like the O&G Giant.
Slight point drop for Dragon Ogres.
New Shaggoth (see above) with much meaner rules! It should be huge!
Forsaken becoming Ambushers, and getting Chaos Armour.
Hellcannons more expensive. I'd prefer them dropped, but that won't happen.

Marks being point-per-model.
MoK: Frenzy and MR(1)
MoT: Same as now
MoN: Same as now + cause Fear.
MoS: Same as now and...Armour Piercing attacks like the Daemonettes, representing them finding weak spot in armour since their strikes are so precise.

They'd cost differently for different units, but should all be about equally good and equal in cost.

Daemonprinces being able to take Magic Items, and replacing Gifts and Eye of the Gods with Mark-specific EotG rolls whenever the champion or character slays a Large Targe or kills a character in a challange. (This includes every unit with a champion in the army, only the champion gets any benefits except for Chosen.)

Chosen being an upgrade to Warriors or Knights. +1 WS, and free rolls on the table whenever any member of the unit qualifies for a roll, applying to every member.

Eye of Chaos: (2D6)

2-4: The Eye is Closed.
5-6: +1 Str
7-8: +1 T
9-10: +1 A
11: +1 WS and I
12: Stubborn and 4+ Wardsave

Something like that, but special for every god.

Theo
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TheOneHawk
Warrior of the Chamber
MoT, same? Wat? No, sir, no. 3+ ward saves on any character we want is far too broken to be left, nevermind an entire unit getting it. Even 5+ parry is pretty crazy.
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Judgex83
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The leech lord
I disagree on a few things Theo. First being Mark of nurgle, Adding fear to it is just pointless since fear and terror now are a joke. As it stands the mark is a joke except for when it comes to shooting. If anything it should make troops T5 or give the unit posion attacks or something of that nature. Again Mark of the boob god is also useless now IMO and giving them AP efectively makes them S5 when it comes to punching through armor and giving them a great weapon would make them S7 and no way they would allow that. Ive never been a fan of psycology effects since they were always very hit or miss so if others think fear and terror mean something i state again that its just my opinion. I agree with your MOK and I agree with Hawk on tzeentch needing a change but changing it to what I dont know since he is the god of magic and change and all that so a ward save makes sense, maybe making it a 5+ but it cant be stacked with anything else at all. I like your idea on forsaken and I always wondered why they didnt have chaos armor since at one point they were warriors. I like your idea of the eye of the gods being different for every god but It seems that GW is more into streamlining codexes now rather then expanding on them. Heck we will be lucky if we dont get "magic of the chaos gods" instead of are 3 different magic lists. Now for actual wishlisting on my part a new hellcannon that doesnt make me want to get violent while building it. New chaos trolls, as much as I love taking other models and chaosifying them, I dont like the plastic river trolls and the current chaos trolls look terrible. Give me back my marauders with slings they were not much but they were better then nothing and dont give me that nonsense that we have horsemen with javelins. Marauders with slings would be awesome with the new shooting rules even if they were range 8.
Edited by Judgex83, Nov 24 2011, 11:35 PM.
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rothgar13
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Clanlord
I'd like to see a price trim for Forsaken and Chosen becoming an upgraded version of Chaos Warriors - those are the main ones. +1 T and/or Poison for Mark of Nurgle is a pretty good idea, and MoT is probably going to get changed up somewhat.

I'd like to see Eye of the Gods re-visited - as it is, it has some situations where you can exploit it (Chosen and Trolls), but mostly, it's a handicap more than it is a boost. Something should be done about that. Also, Chaos Lords and Exalted Heroes are a bit pricey - maybe trim that a bit as well.
Edited by rothgar13, Nov 25 2011, 01:31 AM.
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theorox
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Clanlord
Exalteds could drop like 10p, I agree. But they do fight like a lord and have Chaos Armour. 100p seems reasonable. :)

I like how Nurgle is now, but it needs something...Fear is OK, Poisoned attacks are better! xD That may be a bit too good though?

MoTzeentch, while indeed strong, Isn't that broken I feel. Maybe just saying it stacks to a max of 4+?

Theo
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LORD VOKUL'NAX
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Corrupted Slann
theorox
Nov 24 2011, 04:28 PM
Hellcannons more expensive. I'd prefer them dropped, but that won't happen.
BLASPHEMY!! GW better not axe my beloved hellcannon. I think it adds another dimension to our army. I would hate to have nothing to do in the shooting phase.

Hellcannon forever :rock:


As for wish listing...

-revamped magic lores with lore attributes etc
-some sort of cheapish flying unit... harpies, etc
-Chosen Knights
-magic items for the daemon prince

-plastic chaos dragon kit ^_^
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JaBol On
Warrior of the Chamber
Magic items for DP
Chosen (jugger) knights
Spawns in units or greaterspawn/-kit
Make MoS better
cheeper giant (~200 pts)
Forsaken playable and a kit!!
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Kormak
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High Executioner of Khorne
Well here is what I would like to see:

Marks

MoK: Devastating charge, +1MR (I want a magic resistant that stacks with other MR creating good synergy with items like collar of Khorne)

MoN: Regen 5+ and fear (I know fear isn't that great but I think it makes sense)

MoT: Either caster lords or rolls on the EotG chart at the start of the game

MoS: enemies in B2B suffer a -1 to hit

I want to see armylist options bases around you general, you take a khorne lord then 25% of your core troops have to have MoK or no mark

I want to see gifts that actually make a khorne daemon prince worth using, I expect they will be like big names, I want warshrines bonus to be base around the mark, be it increased magic protection for khorne, increased regen for nurgle, stuff like that.

I want chaos knights to be S5 basic and just have magic attacks, remove fear, it makes no sense.

I want daenomic mounts to be made useful, I think it would be cool if taking them on heroes/lords would allow you to upgrade knights to ride steeds matching (juggers for khorne, etc), I want to see them get 3 wounds so they are more useful on heroes.

I want the shaggoth to be buffed, T6, A6 and dragon ogres buffed to T5 so they are a viable option when compared to chaos knights.

I would actually like to see unit champions go from chaos warriors, I think all chaos warriors should be able accept challenges.

Chosen need to be rethought, maybe they should have enscrolled weapons, any weapon they carry has +1 strength and magical attacks, maybe that should actually be standard for knights, warriors and characters (just not effecting magic weapons).

I want to see core daemons return to the book, be it as a special or rare choice.

I would like to see mutations available for purchase, extra arms to you can wield a two handed weapon and shield (or 3 hand weapons).

I want EoTG changes, don't make it so they have to challenge but just make it so they have a incentive.

Harpies or furies in the list.

Some of the old school special characters make a return, Khorne should have a decent special character, bring back Arbaal, he was such a cool character, Mr hellbrass is missed and the best of the all count Mordrek the Damned.

I want a incentive to play a mono god army, incentives not to take a sorcerer lord, really I want the fluff shown in the rules!
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Judgex83
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The leech lord
MoN is already -1 to hit and its borderline useless.

I like the idea of a percentage requirement matching your lords allignment but I would take it even further with your army is entirely 1 mark or undivided none of this tzeentch playing nice with khorne. Another way would be to do it how last edition demons worked. You can ally but take a leadership check to see if my khorne chosen eat your tzeentch sorcerer.

I would also like to see warshrines do different things based on what you mark the shrine with. Why are my nurgle warriors getting the same buffs as your slanesh warriors when the gods are so very different in their blessings.

it makes sense that chaos knights cause fear they are 8ft tall dudes mounted on gigantic horses covered in demonic armor. If you look at cavalry in real life it was a terrifying idea to face them unless you were geared for it and even then the first few ranks of guys would be killed by the sheer mass of the charge. If anything they should make all heavy cav cause fear unless your unit has spears or halberds but thats just adding rules to a game they are trying to make simpler then it already is.

Every unit needs a leader and thats what the champion is to them. What your asking for would be unbalancing. I myself take champions so I can lock your hero/lord in combat for a turn just so the unit itself doesnt take casualties from their lord /hero. What you want is to give us the ability to do that every turn.

Knights come standard with ensorcereled weapons so not sure what your asking for there. I agree that chosen need to be rethought because atm they are just overpriced warriors with cool models.

Khorne already has valkia and ive seen her used to great effect, I want a lord level nurgle character since nurgle didnt get one this codex.

I like the idea of furies since we are the only army that doesnt have a flying threat to hassle warmachines

I would also like to see demons return but I dont think we will ever have that again since they split up the armies for a reason but chaos marines can kind of take them but its a generic stat line so i wont count it.

Not sure if they could make anything incentive enough to skip an entire phase and in your case the magic phase. Maybe give a khorne lord the ability to use that brass skull spell that they got in SoM just so you can pretend to have a magic phase.
Edited by Judgex83, Nov 25 2011, 11:14 PM.
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rothgar13
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Clanlord
Nurgle is actually -1 WS. That's what makes it useless; -1 to hit would be worth the price of admission, because most things would hit Chaos Warriors on 5's.

Khorne armies, IMO, would be great if you could have some Warrior Priest-equivalents (generates DD, has some abilities that work like Bound Spells, are at least somewhat fighty).
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Kormak
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High Executioner of Khorne
Judgex83
Nov 25 2011, 10:50 PM
MoN is already -1 to hit and its borderline useless.


MoN is -1ws and -1 to with shooting, it is actually far from useless, WS3 hits basic warriors on a 5+, plenty of WS3 units and good for reducing incoming attacks of cheap horde uints, or sauras, or graveguard. -1 to hit in CC is actually very different and draws inspiration from older slaanesh rules, -1 to hit means most things hit them on a 5+, of course the other option is enemies in B2B being halve WS (used to be a slaanesh banner). I would also keep the immune to fear, etc.

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I like the idea of a percentage requirement matching your lords allignment but I would take it even further with your army is entirely 1 mark or undivided none of this tzeentch playing nice with khorne. Another way would be to do it how last edition demons worked. You can ally but take a leadership check to see if my khorne chosen eat your tzeentch sorcerer.


Well I don't think you want to take it that far, I thinkt hat kind of thing should be a self imposed limit, beside if you bring back the rule of only being able to join units of your own mark then I think you start to see more fluffy armies built.

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I would also like to see warshrines do different things based on what you mark the shrine with. Why are my nurgle warriors getting the same buffs as your slanesh warriors when the gods are so very different in their blessings.


Well I would have the giver of glory rule as a undivided rule and then have this rule replaces according to mark, I would like to see it gain a stomp attack much like corpse cart.

Quote:
 
it makes sense that chaos knights cause fear they are 8ft tall dudes mounted on gigantic horses covered in demonic armor. If you look at cavalry in real life it was a terrifying idea to face them unless you were geared for it and even then the first few ranks of guys would be killed by the sheer mass of the charge. If anything they should make all heavy cav cause fear unless your unit has spears or halberds but thats just adding rules to a game they are trying to make simpler then it already is.


It makes no sense when chaos warriors and characters do not cause fear, why are they more scary than chaos warriors? Why are they more scary than a chaos lord with 6 arms 4 with giant claws and a massive axe dripping with bloody riding a chaos steed? They are not, its a silly rule that never made sense in context of the rest of he army. when all cavalry cause fear then maybe chaos knights should, until then I don't think so, they never used to and I would rather have cheaper knights than fear causing chaos knights.

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Every unit needs a leader and thats what the champion is to them. What your asking for would be unbalancing. I myself take champions so I can lock your hero/lord in combat for a turn just so the unit itself doesnt take casualties from their lord /hero. What you want is to give us the ability to do that every turn.


Actually they don't, not if you change the eye the gods rule and allow chaos warriors/knights to accept challenges, champions do not lock lords in combat, they challenge protect your own characters.

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Knights come standard with ensorcereled weapons so not sure what your asking for there. I agree that chosen need to be rethought because atm they are just overpriced warriors with cool models.


Than enscrolled weapons get rethought ;) I think its wierd that chaos knights have them but chosen and heroes don't, why just chaos knights? makes no sense at all.

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Khorne already has valkia and ive seen her used to great effect, I want a lord level nurgle character since nurgle didnt get one this codex.


She is terrible, her use it eye of the gods rerolls, yeah that sounds really in character for Khorne, I take you haven't played any of the previous edition.

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I like the idea of furies since we are the only army that doesnt have a flying threat to hassle warmachines

I would also like to see demons return but I dont think we will ever have that again since they split up the armies for a reason but chaos marines can kind of take them but its a generic stat line so i wont count it.


They are actually doing it with the traitor legions in 40k hence why I mentioned it, having just the core daemons is something that keeps both parties happy. Daemons have their unique units while warriors still have the wanted daemon support that makes the army feel more chaotic, also means they can be pointed differently in relation to internal balance. Something to keep in mind is without heralds they wouldn't as good either so this gives the daemon pure player a reason to use a pure daemon army.

Quote:
 
Not sure if they could make anything incentive enough to skip an entire phase and in your case the magic phase. Maybe give a khorne lord the ability to use that brass skull spell that they got in SoM just so you can pretend to have a magic phase.


Plenty of players did it with the HoC book because they could actually mount a magic defense and really its no different than dwarfs, if you make it so they can actually stop the worse spells then people won't mind the risk. You don't do it like before when you could generate 12 dispel dice, just something like the dwarfs count as a level 2.

If your using a Khorne army you don't want a magic phase, you just want to be able to counter enough of your opponents so the game is worth playing.

rothgar13
Nov 26 2011, 12:21 AM
Nurgle is actually -1 WS. That's what makes it useless; -1 to hit would be worth the price of admission, because most things would hit Chaos Warriors on 5's.

Khorne armies, IMO, would be great if you could have some Warrior Priest-equivalents (generates DD, has some abilities that work like Bound Spells, are at least somewhat fighty).


I think the +1DD mechanic is outdated and not designed for 8th, I think we will see things that give us bonus to dispel attempts or make it easier to channel. All a warrior priest needs to do is give the army +1/2 to dispel attempts, maybe something like the old aspiring hero stats:

M:4 WS:6 S:4 T:4 I:5 W:2 A:3 Ld8

If he had "prayers" then they are something like x unit gains hatred for the turn, X unit gains MR2 for a turn, stuff like that.
Edited by Kormak, Nov 26 2011, 01:29 AM.
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Judgex83
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The leech lord
rothgar13
Nov 26 2011, 12:21 AM
Nurgle is actually -1 WS. That's what makes it useless; -1 to hit would be worth the price of admission, because most things would hit Chaos Warriors on 5's.

Khorne armies, IMO, would be great if you could have some Warrior Priest-equivalents (generates DD, has some abilities that work like Bound Spells, are at least somewhat fighty).
Ahh yes your right I wasnt thinking right it is -1ws i appologise for that mistake and that is why we will never get a mark that is -1 to hit because that would be rediculous even elites needing 5s to hit us. I still remember before the erratta when I was hitting everything on 3s.
Edited by Judgex83, Nov 26 2011, 01:19 AM.
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Kormak
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High Executioner of Khorne
Judgex83
Nov 26 2011, 01:13 AM
Ahh yes your right I wasnt thinking right it is -1ws i appologise for that mistake and that is why we will never get a mark that is -1 to hit because that would be rediculous even elites needing 5s to hit us. I still remember before the erratta when I was hitting everything on 3s.
Good thing its a wishlist then hey! I can tell you something that will never get which turns up every single thread like this, ASF, never going to happen, that is far more game breaking, especially with GW's
Edited by Kormak, Nov 26 2011, 01:25 AM.
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