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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 24 2011, 03:45 PM (1,012 Views) | |
| Deroga | Dec 9 2011, 10:29 AM Post #76 |
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The Chosen
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Ideas in for each given mark are really just brainstorming. Overall i could really care less if these specific ideas are implimented or entirely different ideas come through, i am ultimatly wanting something to encourage as successful mono themed lists as multi-god themed lists. MoK - I completely agree that frenzy isnt the only option for this mark, hatred and KB would both be very fitting for the blood god. - MR is really just a bonus, simply to add 'some' protection to an army that would have no additional magic protection. Perhaps an army wide +2 to dispel attempts like dwarves in addition or instead? - MoK would get dispel channeling, MoT would get offensive spell channling only (no dispel channels.) ill update post with clarifications on the channeling and add the possibilities of KB and Hatred. MoT - Well, MoN provides the exact same/better than IF the entire army is Nurgle. This would not apply if other marks are included in the list, which would make MoT have a benifit that nurgle does not in this situation. - Again, im not particularily attatched to the bonus of any particular mark. - The idea behind MoT units channeling is to provide a strong magic phase for the most magically powerful army. As long as Tzeentch can maintain this role, whatever benifit is fine. - I do not like the current Eye of the Gods table. We can just disagree on this one :P MoS - I agree with your comment about asf being better that frenzy in combat (though it is still rather close when specifically compairing combat only statisitcs). It is worth mentioning that the ASF only applies when in a Mono Slaanesh list, where they will be missing the strenth of combining marks. In a Multi-God list ASF will not exist, making Khorne the premeir combat mark. In my original post i included Hatred with the Mono Khorne army via edit before seeing your response, which would make Khorne superior in combat. Hatred could be replaced with KB. - Yes, they will be Sword Masters of Hoeth that are core, and for potentially 18+ points a model, they would be fine as such. I do beleive we will see a reduction in points for High Elves across the board as well. So 13ish ppm vs 18 ppm would be fine for +1 armor and +1 toughness in combat (if weilding halberd), while having -1 ws. - again, not attatched to asf...maybe +1ws/I/Ld instead? MoN - to 6 would not be possible, as the eye of the gods table would be removed (preference), in favor of set favors for mono themed lists or exalteds/lords. T5 and 5+ regen would only be possble for mono themed, and for pontentially 18+ points per model. I dont think marks should be removed from Marauders, just balanced in points for them, and this is where i think points per model would work fine. Take a unit Warriors from the above for a mono nurgle army.... Warrior base (15) Halberd (1) Mark of Nurgle (5, which could be as much as 10-20 points per model for chosen, or 2-3 for marauders, etc) - so a unit of 18 would be 408 with full command. Great as an anvil, but VERY vulnerable to nuke spells like dwellers, dreaded 13th, infernal gateway, etc. as well as artillary, guns, and the 10 point banner of eternal flame. Not to mention being tarpitted by slaves, marauders, halbadeirs, or any of the many units that are at least 1/4 the points. Or the amazing unkillable/stubborn combat lords of tarpitting goodness, redirecting the whole game with eagles/warhounds/fast cav/etc. |
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| Kormak | Dec 9 2011, 11:16 AM Post #77 |
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High Executioner of Khorne
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OK so I have bene thinking about several things, after posting in a wishlist for WoC, heres what I thought: Well this is what I would do :p MoK Models/units with the Mark of Khorne gain the Killing blow special rule, is immune to psychology and has the MR(1) special rule(or a WS boost instead of MR) General: if you army is lead by a character with the MoK and includes no wizards you may add +2 to all your dispel attempts. Warshrines: In additional to the normal mark of Khorne rules the giver of glory rule is replaced with "Any spell that targets a unit within 6" miscasts on a roll double Giants: No Marks Magic Items Banner of Rage: Models with the MoK gain a 5+ wardsave against wounds caused by magic and the hatred special rule. Axe of Khorne: Great weapon. Models with MoK gain gain the Heroic killing blow special rule Spelleater shield: Shield. Any spell that targets the unit will miscast on a roll of a double, any spell that suffers a miscast is lost for the remainder of the battle on a roll of a 6+ Gifts of Khorne Skulltaker: The hero now causes a killing blow on a 5+ instead of the normal 6+, this has no effect on heroic killing blow Fury of the Blood God: Once per battle the Khorne hero may automatically dispel a spell as if using a dispel magic scroll. Furious Charge: The model gains the devastating charge rule Chosen of Khorne: If the model kills a enemy character or unit champion in a challenge he may immediately issue another. If the model with this reward flees from combat and fails to rally in his following turn his immediately replaced with a chaos Bloodbeast of Khorne Collar of Khorne: The models gains MR3 MoN Models with the Mark of Nurgle gain the Regeneration (5+) special rule and cause fear, if the model causes fear it now causes terror Warshrines: In addition to the normal rules for the mark of nurgle the giver of glory rule is replaced with "models within 6" gain the poison 6 special rule, if they already have the poison special rule then the unit/model causes poison hits on a roll of 5+ instead Magic Items Filth mace: The model gains the poison attack (6+) special rule in addition to this, any roll of a 6 to hit will also ignore armour saves. Festering Shroud: Models with the Mark of Nurgle gain the poison attack (6+) special rule Skin Hidden Plate: Chaos Armour. the Model increases its toughness value by 1 Gifts of nurgle Stream of Corruption: Breathe weapon, models hit by stream of corruption must pass a strength test or suffer a single wound with a -2 save modifier Nurgles rot: A model that suffers a wound but not slain must pass a T test or suffer a additional wound, no save allowed Slime Trail: The model and any unit he joins is with is treated as having no flank or rear for the purpose of combat res Plague Sword: Any weapon carried by the champion is treated as magical and inflicts D3 wounds Noxious Vapors: All models in base to base contact with the character gain the always strike last special rule. MoS Any model that bears the Mark of Slaanesh is immune to fear, terror and panic, in addition to this and model in B2B with a model bearing the Mark of Slaanesh halves its WS (rounding down) Warshrines: In edition to the normal rules for the Mark of Slaanesh the giver of glory rule is replaced with "all friendly models within 6" of the warshrine are now stubborn Spawn: In addition to the normal rules for mark of Slaanesh, chaos spawn gain the always strike first special rule. Magic Items Rapier of Ecstasy:The model gains the Always Strike First special rule, in addition to this, any model that take a wound but are not slain must pass a toughness test or be killed outright, models killed in this way grant a roll on the eye of the gods table. Rapturous Standard: Same as Book Pendant of Slaanesh: Same as book Gifts of Slaanesh Soporific Musk: same as book Aroma of Ecstasy: Enemy units/models in base to base contact with the character decrease their initiative value by 2 Allure of Slannesh: Enemy models wishing to attack the character must first pass a leadership test on their unmodified leadership, if they fail the attacks are wasted Sirens flute: Enemy units must pass a leadership test in order to make a stand and shoot reaction, if they fail then they may still flee as normal Unnatural Swiftness: The model gains the Always strike first special rule. Mark of Tzeentch Characters and warshrines with the Mark of Tzeentch Gain a bound level 4 power, if successfully cast the model may reroll failed armour saves for the remainder of the turn. Chaos sorcerers with the Mark of Tzeentch Add +1 to their casting dice rolls Units with the Mark of Tzeentch gain the following bound spells: 1-9: bound level 4, 12" range 2D6 S2 AP hits 10-18: Bound level 6, 18" range, 2D6 S3 AP hits 19+ : Bound level 8 range 24", 3D6 S3 AP hits Warshrines: In addition to the normal rules for the Mark of Tzeentch The giver of glory rule is replaced with "All Friendly wizards add +1 to their attempts to channel and all friendly bound magic adds +1 to the casting roll. Gifts of Tzeentch Wind Changer: You may reroll the Winds of Magic dice, but the second result stands. 60pts Gift of Chaos: Once per game, you can nominate an enemy character model in base contact with the bearer of this Gift. This character has to take D6 Toughness tests. For each failed test, the enemy model loses a wound with no saves of any kind allowed, for each wound caused you generated a extra powerdice in your next magic phase. 50pts Master of sorcerer: The sorcerer may choose any lore from the warhammer rulebook, the sorcerer has gains the loremaster special rule. 35pts Iridescent Aura: The bearer is clad in a dazzling aura of iridecent light. Attacks against the bearer are at -1 to hit. 25pts Essence of Flame: The bearers innermost self is kindled by an everchanging flame. The bearer has magical and flaming attacks. 15pts Generic Gifts Diabolic Splendour: As Book Conjoined Homunculus: Once per turn the sorcerer may choose to add a extra D6 to his casting roll, this extra can cause a Irresistable force. At the start of his following turn the character must test for stupidity. Mantle of Chaos: As book Daemonic Strength: The characters strength is increased by 1 Extra Arm: The character has an extra arm, this means he may wield a additional weapon for a extra +1 attack (unless wielding a magical weapon) or use a shield and a two handed weapon. Uncontrollable Fury: The model is subject the Frenzy special rule. Enscrolled Weapons: Any mundane weapon carried by the model is treated as a magical weapon with a additional +1 strength (maybe) Chaos Warriors: 13pts each (I have put 13 for now however I do wonder if 14 would be better) M:4 WS:5 BS:3 S:4 T:4 W:1 I:4 A:2 Ld 8 Unit Size: 10+ Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Champions of the Dark Gods, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Eye of the Gods Options: Great Weapons + 2pts Additional Hand weapons +1pts Halberds +2pts Shields +1pts Standard + 15pts Musician + 10pts Mark of Khorne + 45pts Mark of Nurgle + 40pts Mark of Slaanesh + 35pts Mark of Tzeentch + 50pts May take a magical Standard up to 50pts Chosen Warriors: 18pts each M:4 WS:6 BS:3 S:4 T:4 W:1 I:5 A:2 Ld 8 Unit Size: 10+ Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Champions of the Dark Gods, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Eye of the Gods, Enscrolled Weapons Options: Great Weapons + 3pts Additional Hand weapons +2pts Halberds +4pts Shields +1pts Standard + 15pts Musician + 10pts Mark of Khorne + 45/50pts Mark of Nurgle + 40pts Mark of Slaanesh + 35pts Mark of Tzeentch + 50pts May take a magical Standard up to 75pts Enscrolled Weapons: A model with this special rule treats all its attacks as magical. Mark of Chaos Undivided: This replaces the will of chaos rule, models may reroll failed panic tests. Exalted Champion of Chaos: 120pts M:4 WS:7 BS:3 S:5 T:5 W:2 I:6 A:4 Ld 8 Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Champions of the Dark Gods, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Eye of the Gods, Enscrolled Weapons Options: Great Weapons + 4pts Additional Hand weapons +4pts Halberds +6pts Shields +2pts Mark of Khorne + 30pts Mark of Nurgle + 40pts Mark of Slaanesh + 30pts Mark of Tzeentch + 30pts Barded Steed + 16pts Daenomic Mount +40pts Juggernaugt of Khone + 50pts Rotbeast of Nurgle + 50pts Disc of Tzeentch + 35pts Steed of Slaanesh + 40pts Chariot + 100pts Magic items: May take up to 50pts of Magic Items Chaos Gifts: May take up to 25pts of Chaos Gifts Chaos Lord: 190pts M:4 WS:8 BS:3 S:5 T:5 W:3 I:7 A:5 Ld 9 Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Champions of the Dark Gods, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Eye of the Gods, Enscrolled Weapons Options: Great Weapons + 6pts Additional Hand weapons +6pts Halberds +8pts Shields +4pts Mark of Khorne + 30pts Mark of Nurgle + 40pts Mark of Slaanesh + 30pts Mark of Tzeentch + 30pts Barded Steed + 24pts Daenomic Mount +40pts Juggernaugt of Khone + 50pts Rotbeast of Nurgle + 50pts Disc of Tzeentch + 35pts Steed of Slaanesh + 40pts Chariot + 100pts Chaos Dragon + 320pts Magic items: May take up to 100pts of Magic Items Chaos Gifts: May take up to 50pts of Chaos Gifts Daemon Prince: 250pts M:8 WS:8 BS:3 S:5 T:5 W:4I:7 A:5 Ld 8 Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Champions of the Dark Gods, Mark of Chaos Undivided, Eye of the Gods, Daemonic, Terror Options: Fly + 20pts Mark of Khorne + 30pts Mark of Nurgle + 40pts Mark of Slaanesh + 30pts Mark of Tzeentch + 30pts Unless given the Mark of Khorne then the daemon prince may be upgraded to a sorcerer at 35pts per magic level up to a maximum of lvl4 Magic items: May take up to 100pts of Magic Items Chaos Gifts: May take up to 50pts of Chaos Gifts Dragon Ogres: 65pts M:7 WS:4 BS:2 S:5 T:4 W:4 I:2 A:3 Ld 8 Unit Size: 3+ Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Scaly skin (6+), The will of chaos, Fear, Storm Rage, immune to psychology Options: Great Weapons + 10pts, additional Hand weapons +6pts Stormrage Any lightning based attack targeted at a unit within 12" of the dragon ogres is directed at the dragon ogres instead on a roll of a 6+, work out the attack as normal, every wound causes actually restores a wound to the unit previous lost during the battle. Dragon OrgeShaggoth: 240pts M:7 WS:6 BS:2 S:6 T:5 W:6 I:4 A:5 Ld 9 Unit Size: 1 Equipment: Hand weapon, Chaos armour Special Rules: Scaly skin (5+), The will of chaos, Terror, Storm Rage, Immune to psychology, eye of the Gods, Ancient Promise Options: Great Weapons + 12pts, additional Hand weapons +8pts Stormrage Any lightning based attack targeted at a unit within 12" of the Shaggoth is directed at the dragon ogres instead on a roll of a 5+, work out the attack as normal, every wound causes actually restores a wound to the unit previous lost during the battle. Ancient Promise Because of the pact the shaggoths made with the chaos gods they are all bust immortal, as a result they are immune to heroic killing blow and can never take more than a single wound from any attack. Daemonic: Models are treated as having magical attacks, stubborn and have a 5+ wardsave, if the model already have a wadsave it is instead increased by one to a maximum of a 4+ (was thinking 3+ but might be abit to much. Personally I don't think marauders should have marks, they are not champions of the dark gods while Chaos warriors are, while they may worship them they haven't proven themselves yet. removing marks from marauders solves more problems than changing the points to per model, all your really doing is drastically decreasing the size of the army which isn't something chaos warriors now. 400pts for 18 chaos warriors is just to many points. Edited by Kormak, Dec 9 2011, 11:20 AM.
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| Deroga | Dec 9 2011, 12:33 PM Post #78 |
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The Chosen
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I like your changes in general, very well thought out. As far as the 400 point unit of 18 nurgle warriors being to much, this is curently being used effectivly all the time... Chosen of Tzeentch x 18 halberds or shields Full Command favor of the gods wailing banner this unit is 467 points and its gift will be random. most of the time people include at least 1 warshrine, making this a 577 point setup. |
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| Kormak | Dec 9 2011, 05:55 PM Post #79 |
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High Executioner of Khorne
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while that is true its also a special unit rather core |
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| Player not found | Dec 9 2011, 09:14 PM Post #80 |
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The Chosen
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I've always thought that knights, in a way, were already chosen... Chosen who rolled horses and enscrolled weapons on the EotG table (even though the option is not there)... We don't need to add a Chosen-squared unit, the chosen chosen are heroes and lords, not troops. |
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| Kormak | Dec 9 2011, 09:35 PM Post #81 |
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High Executioner of Khorne
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No but I do think we need need a unit of MC so we can actually use our characters on daemonic mounts! |
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| itsuperslug | Dec 9 2011, 11:57 PM Post #82 |
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The Chosen
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been thinking about whole to freshen up the different marks. Wondering about scaling them for different levels of unit. e.g MoK marauders/ beasts = frenzy warriors/ knights = re-roll charge range, frenzy chosen/ characters = MR1, re-roll charge, frenzy MoS marauders/ beasts = immune to psychology warriors/ knights = +1 I, ItP chosen/ characters = ignores terain, +1I, ItP etc... Edited by itsuperslug, Dec 9 2011, 11:58 PM.
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