Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Welcome to The Chamber of the Everchosen. We hope you enjoy your visit!


Here at COTEC we are all about the Warriors of Chaos in Warhammer Fantasy Battle.

Tactics to help you slaughter your opponent on the tabletop, through to galleries on how to build your next Warshrine. Its all covered... and growing!

We are a forum for gamers and hobbyist alike and again would like to welcome you to a fun, friendly, warm place and hope to see you again!


Join our legion! Takes less than a minute and gives you access to everything!


If you're already a member please log in to your account by entering the correct runes and words of power:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
2500 List - need some help; I'm sick of getting rolled so some advice on lists would be great
Topic Started: Nov 30 2011, 03:04 PM (368 Views)
Smouchus22
Slave
[ * ]
I have a bit of a power player in my gaming group and I'm getting a little sick of losing to him (he plays O&G and TK). My biggest problem is I like a fun list.

How do you guys and girls reckon this will match up against a typical O&G or TK army:

Lord
Chaos Lord, MoT, Sword of Battle, Enchanted Shield, Talisman of Preservation

Heroes
Lvl 1 Sorc., MoT, Dispel Scroll, Lore of Death (Dispel Scroll caddy)
Lvl 2 Sorc., MoT, Infernal Puppet, Flickering Fire, Lore of Tzeentch (main caster)
Exhalted Hero BSB, MoT, Stream of Corruption, Blasted Standard

Core
49 Marauders, MoT, Full command, GW, LA (BSB with unit)
29 Warriors, MoT, Full command, Halberd, Banner of Rage (Lord in unit)
29 Warriors, MoT (could be MoK), Full command, Halberd (thinking of changing to shield), Standard of Discipline (Lvl 1 sorc in unit)

Rare
1 Hellcannon

Total points 2497.

Blasted banner because marauders always get shot up and the ward will be handy. All units will be deployed 10 wide.

My biggest problem with the list is that there doesn't appear to be any fun in it or enough units. I would love to take a Giant w/MoS but it gets destroyed by turn 2 (espeically if I go second which is usually the case).

One of my typical lists would have blocks of 25 warriors, 50 marauders, Knights, Giant, some warhounds, lvl 4 spellcaster (or combat lord with a lvl 2) and a BSB. Most would have MoN (except Giant - MoS took out 900 points of Dark Elves once and it was awesome).

Thanks guys and girls (I can't be discrimitory these days apparently :D).
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
David L
The Chosen
If your level 1 has mark of Tzeentch, he has to take Lore of Tzeentch.

If you are having trouble, my first thought is you need more units. It seems like the enemy can fairly easily keep two of your blocks busy while concentrating on the third.

Sword of Battle is terrible on the Lord. Get higher strength, even if you have to use a great weapon.

Blasted Standard for Marauders seems a waste to me. Just field more Marauders. At 5 pts each with large bases, sheer numbers is the best shooting defense.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Smouchus22
Slave
[ * ]
Thanks David.

I missed the rule about the spellcasters.

Based on your advice, I have made the following changes:

Lord
Chaos Lord, MoT, Sword of Might, Enchanted Shield, Talisman of Preservation

Heroes
Lvl 2 Sorc., MoT, Infernal Puppet, Lore of Tzeentch (main caster)
Exhalted Hero BSB, MoT

Core
60 Marauders, MoT, Full command, GW, (BSB with unit)
25 Warriors, MoT, Full command, Shield, Banner of Rage (Lord in unit) [running 5 wide frontage]
5 Hounds
5 Hounds

Special
10 Knights, MoT, Champion and standard, Banner of Swiftness (unsure about that one)

Rare
1 Hellcannon
1 Chaos Giant, MoS

Points 2490.

I don't think the banner of swiftness on the knights is worth it so that will probably get changed. However, I have no idea what banner may be good for the BSB. Also, I am thinking it may be worth splitting up the Marauders into two blocks of 30.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
rulesfuhrer
Slave
[ * ]
Your second list looks alot better, there are more targets for him so he shouldn't be able to swamp you so easily. Just one question, why the MoT on the marauders? I'd personally go with MoK, or is it a flavour thing?

What sort of lists is the guy taking? What power combos is he using? Savage orc+shrunken head horde? troll hordes?

There aren't any Tomb Kings players in my area so I cant help you in that department sorry
Edited by rulesfuhrer, Dec 3 2011, 05:20 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
David L
The Chosen
Smouchus22
Dec 2 2011, 11:51 AM
However, I have no idea what banner may be good for the BSB.
The answer is almost always "none". Give him normal equipment.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
rulesfuhrer
Slave
[ * ]
One thing I forgot to mention, I'd throw the flaming banner on one of the units, probably the knights since theres no where else to put it except the BSB :P

Tomb Kings and princes are flammable, Whilst trolls lose regen if you play O&G, its only 10 points, and its very effective if you come up against an enemy with regen.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
GeneralofChaos42
Member Avatar
The Puppet Master
Love mono lists, good luck with the list.



GoC
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Grayskunk
Slave
[ * ]
I like the list and love Marauders, I was wondering are you taking all of them in one unit though? I would have thought it better to split them into two personally but thats just me.
I take MON throughout my army as I like to go themed but i also get why people like to mix after all it is Chaotic lol I like the -1 to WS MON gives to attackers especially if they are fairly low WS anyway can cause problems and the -1 to hit when the enemy is shooting you up is cool.
If you are taking special chracters think about Festus as he gives your unit 5 plus regen and is a level 2 mage as well.
Against shooty armies like the hounds in there hounds are nice cheap meat shields and are good for generally getting in the enemies way, another possible option are Forsaken very quick lots of attacks they got overlooked by me a lot at first but they are pretty sweet if you use them right.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
conjoy
Exalted Guardian
I really wonder why you are not taking a Mage Lord on Disc?
With one of these, 3rd Eye and the Puppet you can really bring some pain. If he brings the Little Waagh and takes the number 6 spell, you just line up your mage on one of his flanks and shoot that big tamplate down his line and watch his units evaporate as they fail I tests. Any unit with Choppas you bring Treason of Tzentch to bear.
The best way to beat O&G is to be MSU and outmanouvere him. He doesn't have that much to close the gap quickly. One unit of Marauder Horse with Javelins and the MoSl should be able to take care of his giant for multiple turns by moving into shooting range about 9 inches away, and flee every time he charges you. With no Swiftstride and a 3inch head start you should consistently get away meaning it only moves 1D6. And with Ldr 8 from the Musician and 16 inch movement you should be able rinse and repeat for 3-4 turns.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
rulesfuhrer
Slave
[ * ]
conjoy
Dec 8 2011, 08:05 PM
I really wonder why you are not taking a Mage Lord on Disc?
With one of these, 3rd Eye and the Puppet you can really bring some pain. If he brings the Little Waagh and takes the number 6 spell, you just line up your mage on one of his flanks and shoot that big tamplate down his line and watch his units evaporate as they fail I tests. Any unit with Choppas you bring Treason of Tzentch to bear.
The best way to beat O&G is to be MSU and outmanouvere him. He doesn't have that much to close the gap quickly. One unit of Marauder Horse with Javelins and the MoSl should be able to take care of his giant for multiple turns by moving into shooting range about 9 inches away, and flee every time he charges you. With no Swiftstride and a 3inch head start you should consistently get away meaning it only moves 1D6. And with Ldr 8 from the Musician and 16 inch movement you should be able rinse and repeat for 3-4 turns.
Just a point here, what competitive O&G general takes a giant these days?

The OP has stated the guy is a powergamer, and I dont know a single 'powergamer' that would take one, they plain old suck in 8th.

Mage lord on disc does perform very well though.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
rothgar13
Member Avatar
Clanlord
Agreed - we powergamers steer clear of Giants (I also play O&G, and I can tell you GW has a lot of work to do before one of those will grace my lists).

The main two things you really have to be concerned with when playing a souped-up O&G list are usually the Horde of SOB's (Savage Orc Big 'Uns), and the dirt-cheap and hard-hitting chaff, such as Fanatics, Mangler Squigs, and blocks of Trolls (sometimes multiple solo Trolls).

The SOB's you can either try and bait into exposing a flank (remember that they are Frenzied and thus must pursue/overrun), or you can just try and fight fire with fire and step up to the plate with a Horde of your own (surprisingly, a Horde of Khorne Halberd Warriors with a big and mean Exalted Hero BSB costs about the same as that unit of SOB's with their Shaman and Black Orc BSB, and can likely win that fight outright).

The chaff you deal with by either sacrificing your own chaff (Dogs are great for this), or you can pelt them with shooting (Marauder Horsemen with Javelins can take care of Fanatics without much trouble). You want fire to deal with Trolls, so a small unit of Chaos Warriors with the Flaming Banner will usually cut them down before they get to hurt you.

If your opponent likes to use lots of Goblins to tarpit and bog you down, counter with a Hellcannon - panic tests at -1 Ld are absolutely devastating for the little greenies. Even if you don't get to shoot with, T6 and Unbreakable also means that Night Gobbos can't do much of anything about it running up to them and grinding them down via Thunderstomps and the like. I'd also advise to either put the Mark of Tzeentch and the Blasted Standard on the Knights or leave them at home - the Doom Diver catapult wrecks them all by itself otherwise. Even then, steer them clear of Trolls and Black Orcs.

Hope that helps. Good luck! :)
Edited by rothgar13, Dec 10 2011, 06:57 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Harbinger
The Chosen
You could also pull the sword of might off the lord and give him the chaos runesword. Yes you have to lose the enchanted shield, but now he is WS9, Str6, and if he is in the warrior unit, throws 7 attacks. Since you gave them shields, (which i don't recommend since frenzied troops can't make a parry save, better off with the halberds, or both to up armour against shooting). You can also drop two knights and one marauder, adding 5 warriors to your unit and then you can run them 6 wide still with 5 ranks.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
« Previous Topic · Armylist · Next Topic »
Add Reply