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Book of Secrets question..
Topic Started: May 21 2011, 07:32 PM (521 Views)
LORD VOKUL'NAX
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Corrupted Slann
I just have a quick question for everyone. If give an Exalted with the MoT the book of Secrets, does he use spells out of the Lore of Tzeentch or can he choose from the lores of fire, shadow or death.


The book of secrets makes him a level one sorcerer, who if marked with Tzeentch would normally be forced to generate spells from that lore. HOWEVER, the description of the book of secrets (in the FAQ) clearly says that he mentions that he chooses from the lore of fire, death or shadow AND makes on mention of god specific lores.

These seem to be in contradiction. Which rule takes precedence?
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Krakanrock
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Exalted Guardian
I just went over the FAQ and didn't see anything about deity specific spells mentioned anywhere in conjunction w/ the Book. So, yes, the exalted w/ Mark of Tzeetch must choose one of the lores that the Book of Secrets gives you access to. You do, however, get the +1 to cast.
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sometimesafish
The Chosen
pg 106 of the WoC book states that sorc's with a mark "always generate spells from the lore appropriate to that mark."

This would be mutually exclusive to the book of secrets rule that states you must chose from only its lore choices. Therefore, you can argue that you cannot have both, having MoT means you use the tzeentch lore, yet you are not allowed to due to the book rules, another GW rule divide by zero vortex of doom. My group goes with no MoT on the book as the two rules are incompatible and there is no real reason to assume one overrides the other, both could be argued as taking precedence.
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Franc
Warrior of the Chamber
You are complicating.
V1.3 WoC errata, quote:
“Treat the bearer as a Level 1 Wizard, who may use
the Lore of Fire, Lore of Shadow or Lore of Death. He may
not attempt to channel. If he ever casts a spell with irresistible
force he must roll D6+1 rather than 2D6 on the Miscast
table.”
So, he isn't chaos sorcerer, he is lvl1 wizard. There goes your dillema.
Hence he cannot pick lore spells, nor he can add +1 to cast if he is marked Tzeentch.
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chiram
The Chosen
he is treated as a lvl 1 wizard meaning he can cast 1 spell and has his normal casting value.
mark of tzeentch overrides the normal cast and adds a +1 to cast just as mark of tzeentch is the only thing in the game that can add to your wardsave.
why do you people make it so complicating.
the dude has 1 spell and has a +1 to cast ( as do all lvl 1 wizards )
but because he's tzeentch he has a +2 to cast.
but he cannot choose from the lore of tzeentch because he's only channeling the power of the warp through the book which is enhanced by tzeentch.
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Franc
Warrior of the Chamber
chiram
Jun 7 2011, 09:20 PM

but because he's tzeentch he has a +2 to cast.

No...only chaos sorcerers marked with tzeentch get additional +1 to cast. He's not chaos sorcerer. He's Exalted Lvl1 Wizard.
I'm not complicating I'm just enforcing RAW, as it should be enforced B)

Quote:
 
Hence he cannot pick lore spells, nor he can add +1 to cast if he is marked Tzeentch.

I should have written: "...nor he can add addittional +1 to cast because he's marked Tzeentch."
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chiram
The Chosen
Franc
Jun 8 2011, 12:18 AM
chiram
Jun 7 2011, 09:20 PM

but because he's tzeentch he has a +2 to cast.

No...only chaos sorcerers marked with tzeentch get additional +1 to cast. He's not chaos sorcerer. He's Exalted Lvl1 Wizard.
I'm not complicating I'm just enforcing RAW, as it should be enforced B)

Quote:
 
Hence he cannot pick lore spells, nor he can add +1 to cast if he is marked Tzeentch.

I should have written: "...nor he can add addittional +1 to cast because he's marked Tzeentch."

mark description states: any model marked with the mark of tzeentch gets a +1 to his ward save if none is pressent he gets a 6+ and a +1 to cast spells.
so if i read that as it sais any model with the mark gets a +1 to cast wether its a wizard or not.
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Krakanrock
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Exalted Guardian
Franc
Jun 7 2011, 06:39 PM
So, he isn't chaos sorcerer, he is lvl1 wizard.

Ummm...I'm pretty sure that those two terms are synonymous. 'Wizard' just being a more generic term for anyone who can cast magic.
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Alric
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Warrior of the Chamber
In the WoC army book under mark of tzeentch " A Wizard with the mark of tzeentch has +1 on his attempts to cast spells."
So it does say " A Wizard "
So the character would get a +1 to cast. But its a exaulted not a chaos sorcerer so he wouldnt use lore of tzeentch , but the lores listed under book of secrets.
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chiram
The Chosen
Alric
Jun 8 2011, 03:31 PM
In the WoC army book under mark of tzeentch " A Wizard with the mark of tzeentch has +1 on his attempts to cast spells."
So it does say " A Wizard "
So the character would get a +1 to cast. But its a exaulted not a chaos sorcerer so he wouldnt use lore of tzeentch , but the lores listed under book of secrets.

exactly and the faq state thata model with the book of secret is treated as a wizard so he does get the +1 for a lvl 1 wizard and a +1 for being marked tzeentch

jeez why do you people have such a hard time with these rules everything about the book of secrects ( not every rule , far from it ) is explained to the detail if you combine our army book and faq.
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Bezerker
Bezerker
I don't think you get a +1 to cast due to tz. Just for being a wizard.
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Franc
Warrior of the Chamber
Alric
Jun 8 2011, 03:31 PM
In the WoC army book under mark of tzeentch " A Wizard with the mark of tzeentch has +1 on his attempts to cast spells."
So it does say " A Wizard "
So the character would get a +1 to cast. But its a exaulted not a chaos sorcerer so he wouldnt use lore of tzeentch , but the lores listed under book of secrets.

Indeed it does. I apologize for needless posting.
When you play three different game systems and aboult half of dozen armies you can easily get confused between so much rules and errata :wacko:
Nevertheless, I should have had the AB checked first.
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Krakanrock
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Exalted Guardian
bezerker
Jun 8 2011, 09:50 PM
I don't think you get a +1 to cast due to tz. Just for being a wizard.

Why WOULDN'T an exalted w/ MoT and BoS get the +1 to cast?? :blink: :huh:

There are only 2 criteria that he needs to meet in order to get that:
1 - The character must be a wizard (which he becomes by having the Book of Secrets)
2 - The character must have the Mark of Tzeentch

Again, see Alric's post:

Alric
Jun 8 2011, 03:31 PM)
In the WoC army book under mark of tzeentch " A Wizard with the mark of tzeentch has +1 on his attempts to cast spells."
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LORD VOKUL'NAX
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Corrupted Slann
Krakanrock
Jun 9 2011, 02:15 AM

Why WOULDN'T an exalted w/ MoT and BoS get the +1 to cast?? :blink: :huh:

There are only 2 criteria that he needs to meet in order to get that:
1 - The character must be a wizard (which he becomes by having the Book of Secrets)
2 - The character must have the Mark of Tzeentch

Again, see Alric's post:

Agreed. He meets all the criteria required to get the 1+ to cast. I don't see the confusion here; it seems pretty clear.
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