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Destandor, Jailor of Hated Magic; Personal house rules
Topic Started: Aug 6 2011, 02:13 AM (451 Views)
Destandor
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Jailor of Hated Magic
The Chaos Lord known as Destandor is one of Khorne's most favoured followers. For his bloody deeds against the inhabitants of Nordland and Hochland as well as Skaven and countless others, he was gifted with the axe Guilliotine, the first Axe of Khorne forged and which was far more powerful than its replicas. Khorne saw the strength and willpower in the fierce warrior and in a vision put him on a mighty task - to imprison all spells known to this day. To aid him, Destandor was granted the juggernaut Rendurok, and a cloak of chains, able to trap magic inside them.

Destandor - 430 pts
M:4 WS:9 BS:3 S:5(6) T:5 W:3 I:7 A:5 Ld:9

Equipment:
Guilliotine (Magic Weapon)
This was the first and mightiest Axe of Khorne, forged in the pyre of a dead Daemon Prince of Khorne and quenched in said mans blood. It cuts of any victims head as clean as its namesake, and also just as bloody.
This axe gives Destandor +1 Strength (included above) and the Killing Blow special rule. However, when rolling to wound, rolls of 5 or 6 causes Killing Blow instead of just rolls of 6.

Chains of the Spell Prison (Enchanted Item)
This cloak is made of several chains with their origin in the rumoured spell prison - a tomb where Khorne wishes to entrap all magic and then execute them, banishing all hated magic once and for all. They have a repellant effect on magic, and may also entrap spells completely should they not have enough power.
Destandor have Magic Resistance (3). Also, should a spell directed at Destandor (or a unit he has joined) be dispelled, roll a D6. On a 5+, the wizard forgets that spell and cannot use it for the rest of the game.

Chaos Armour.

Special Rules:
The Will of Chaos
Eye of the Gods
Mark of Khorne

Mage Hunter: Destandors quest is to to hunt down and entrap the magic so hated by his patron god. He hates all models capable of casting spells. In addition, as long as he is Frenzied he may not take a leadership test to prevent charging should he have the possibility to charge a spellcaster or a unit joined by one. Note also that he may not charge another unit instead of the spellcaster (or its unit) if he are within charging range of more than one.

Rendurok: Rendurok is a Juggernaut with +1 attack and the Impact Hits (D3) special rules.

How does this sound? i thought it would be fun to creat some personal rules for my Chaos Lord whom I am about to convert a model for, and as I as going to use parts from the new lord on manticore I thought the chains could add a nice twitch. I am not sure if his price is right, as usual that thing is something hard to set right. What do you say?
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Krakanrock
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Exalted Guardian
Have you had a chance to play-test this at all?

I think I'd just leave the jugger as a regular ol' jugger. The Mage Hunter rule is nice as it keeps some of the power of a Chaos Lord in check.

I can just see this guy roaming about the field all on his own looking for mage skulls to add to Khorne's collection. :rock:
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Destandor
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Jailor of Hated Magic
Krakanrock
Aug 6 2011, 03:54 AM
Have you had a chance to play-test this at all?

I think I'd just leave the jugger as a regular ol' jugger. The Mage Hunter rule is nice as it keeps some of the power of a Chaos Lord in check.

I can just see this guy roaming about the field all on his own looking for mage skulls to add to Khorne's collection. :rock:

1 - No, it is hard to find guys willing to play against homemade rules but I'll try. Should see if I can organize a campaign of some sort where everyone can create his own general (with the others checking them to avoid them being OP)

2 - Rendurok is supposed to be slightly more fierce than other Juggernauts. Should I perhaps remove one of the additions to him?

3 - That is good to hear.

4 - Yes! Will totally have to make a trophy rack for him... Or even hang those skulls in the chains B)
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Krakanrock
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Exalted Guardian
Quote:
 
2 - Rendurok is supposed to be slightly more fierce than other Juggernauts. Should I perhaps remove one of the additions to him?

Maybe play test w/ one and then the other. I think maybe the +1A would be the better option. The impact hits seem a bit iffy to me.

Quote:
 
4 - Yes! Will totally have to make a trophy rack for him... Or even hang those skulls in the chains

The skull on the chains seems to much like Skulltaker's cloak of skulls. I'd go for the trophy rack. Maybe even just put the jugger on a huge pile of skulls.
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Destandor
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Jailor of Hated Magic
Krakanrock
Aug 6 2011, 04:12 AM


Quote:
 
Quote:
 
2 - Rendurok is supposed to be slightly more fierce than other Juggernauts. Should I perhaps remove one of the additions to him?

Maybe play test w/ one and then the other. I think maybe the +1A would be the better option. The impact hits seem a bit iffy to me.

Hmm... How does Impact hits (1) and frenzy sound for him?

Quote:
 
Quote:
 
4 - Yes! Will totally have to make a trophy rack for him... Or even hang those skulls in the chains

The skull on the chains seems to much like Skulltaker's cloak of skulls. I'd go for the trophy rack. Maybe even just put the jugger on a huge pile of skulls.

Very good point, trophy racks are better. And I actually have a pile of skulls left from my hellcannon, they will come in handy.
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Krakanrock
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Exalted Guardian
Quote:
 
How does Impact hits (1) and frenzy sound for him?

That sounds pretty good actually. There's the possibility he loses the +1A and the impact hits aren't super crazy.
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Tome
Seeker of the Winds
Hmm... At his base, he's a Khorne Lord on a Juggernaut with the Axe of Khorne and a Collar of Khorne. This is worth 345 points, so that's an 85 points difference.

For those 85 points, he gets:
-Upgraded Killing Blow
-Has a chance to cause a Wizard to forget spells if it's foolish enough to cast them at it.
-Has Hatred for Wizards.
-Has a killier Juggernaut.

When you consider what 85 points of upgrades can normally do for a model, I'd say that's probably fine, particularly since it lacks a Ward save.

I should probably post the stats I came up with for my Lord one day.
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Blood-Spattered Angel
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The Chosen
Just a few concerns reading your proposed rules:

Quote:
 
However, when rolling to wound, rolls of 5 or 6 causes Killing Blow instead of just rolls of 6.


That is a game-breaker, since the standard odds of killing blow are approx. 18%, but this would jump to 35% - not to mention that there may be instances where a character would not normally wound on 5. This is made worse when combined with Hatred (Wizards).

I would suggest leaving Killing Blow rules alone, and change the 2nd sentence for Guillotine to: "However, when confronting a Wizard Khorne's palpable hatred unleashes itsel from the blade: all attacks made against Wizards have the Heroic Killing Blow ability." This way you have a dedicated mage-killer (reroll to hit on 1st turn, can kill Slaan and Greater Daemons in one hit) using regular abilites that are easier to playtest.


Quote:
 
Rendurok: Rendurok is a Juggernaut with +1 attack and the Impact Hits (D3) special rules.


Stomp in 8th is meant to be a way to reduce overuse of Impact hits, so any model with both is a bit beardy. +1A is fine since Juggers normally have 2+1, but I propse that a fluffier version would be either:
- Devastating Charge + "Brass Horn"* (so 1st: 3S6+1S5, 2nd: 2S5+1S5) [Hammer]
OR - Devastating Charge + "Brass Maw"** (so 1st: 3S5+1S6, 2nd: 2S5+1S6) [Anvil]

*Brass Horn: all close combat attacks are at +1S during the first round of combat.
** Brass Maw: Stomp attacks are resolved at +1S

I would be wary of giving a daemon Frenzy since the bizarre rules history daemons have had with psychology (and if Bloodletters don't Frenzy, Juggers certainly wouldn't).

Everything else seems fine.
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Destandor
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Jailor of Hated Magic
Quote:
 
I would suggest leaving Killing Blow rules alone, and change the 2nd sentence for Guillotine to: "However, when confronting a Wizard Khorne's palpable hatred unleashes itsel from the blade: all attacks made against Wizards have the Heroic Killing Blow ability." This way you have a dedicated mage-killer (reroll to hit on 1st turn, can kill Slaan and Greater Daemons in one hit) using regular abilites that are easier to playtest.
I quite like this, actually. Still, considering this axe isn't just supposed to be a mage-killer, I'd probably add one more +1 S, I think...

Quote:
 
Stomp in 8th is meant to be a way to reduce overuse of Impact hits, so any model with both is a bit beardy. +1A is fine since Juggers normally have 2+1, but I propse that a fluffier version would be either:
- Devastating Charge + "Brass Horn"* (so 1st: 3S6+1S5, 2nd: 2S5+1S5) [Hammer]
OR - Devastating Charge + "Brass Maw"** (so 1st: 3S5+1S6, 2nd: 2S5+1S6) [Anvil]
Oh right, I forgot they have stomp now! Off with impacts, then, and welcome Devastating charge and brass horn!

I also had some response on another forum, this is some suggestions I got there:
-Make his hatred rule based off units with a wizard level, not casting spells
-Weaken the power of the Spell Trapping

The first one I am fine with, but the second, not so much. It is not that of a high chance the spell will be forgotten, and something worth remembering is that friendly spells directed at him can also be forgotten (mainly augments)! Then, there also exists the Spellthieving Sword and the Spell Destroyer, who are a bit more reliable when it comes to destroying spells.
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Blood-Spattered Angel
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The Chosen
Quote:
 
welcome Devastating charge and brass horn!


copyrighting "Brass Horn" :) .

One follow-up comment: Be wary about giving +2S on the Guilltoine, as:
- +2S, KB/HKB = 75pts. (20pts. per S bonus + 25pts. for KB + 10pts. for limited HKB)*, whereas +1S would be a more reasonable 55pts.
- Chain of Spell Prison would be 55pts. minimum**, so you would have a Chaos Lord with 110pts worth of magic items (Mage-Hunter would count as a Daemon Gift) at +1S and 130pts at +2S.
- You don't need S7 when you have 5/6 S6 attacks at I7. At S6, you're wounding warmachines on 5s, Bloodthirsters on 4s, and virtually all rank and file on 2s. Notice how the only magic weapon in the WoC book that offers better than +1S is 75pts., random and can backfire?
- based on what you have presented, in the first round of combat with Destandor/Rendurok would be: 9xS6, 1xS5. Compared to a regular Khorne Lord on Jugger with Axe of Khorne: 6xS6, 3xS5, and compared to Archaeon: 8xS5 (or 13xS5). Adding a further +1S would be too much.

Sorry about extensive post- your character concept is good, but balance isn't easy (just ask Mat Ward & Gav Thorpe :lol: ).

*BRB: Sword of Might (+1S, 20pts.)/Ogre Blade (+2S, 40pts.)/Giant's Blade (+3S, 60pts.). WoC: Axe of Khorne (+1S & KB, 45pts.), also compare Sword of Change (+1S & special, 65pts.). Bret: Virtue of Heroism (HKB, 40pts.). Limited HKB would be worth between 25-40pts.
** Not as precise- BRB: Obsidian Trinket (MR1, 15pts)/Obsidian Amulet (MR2, 30pts.)/Obsidian Lodestone (MR3, 45pts.). DoC: Spell Destroyer (acts as dispel scroll (25ps.), spell lost on 4+, one use only, 50pts.)
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Destandor
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Jailor of Hated Magic
What you say is correct. How is this then, for a slightly new profile:
Destandor - 430 pts
M:4 WS:9 BS:3 S:5(6) T:5 W:3 I:7 A:5 Ld:9

Equipment:
Guilliotine (Magic Weapon)
This was the first and mightiest Axe of Khorne, forged in the pyre of a dead Daemon Prince of Khorne and quenched in said mans blood. It cuts of any victims head - especially wizards heads - as clean as its namesake, and also just as bloody.
This axe gives Destandor +1 Strength (included above) and the Killing Blow special rule. However, when rolling to wound against wizards, it instead gains the Heroic Killing Blow special rule.

Chains of the Spell Prison (Enchanted Item)
This cloak is made of several chains with their origin in the rumoured spell prison - a tomb where Khorne wishes to entrap all magic and then execute them, banishing all hated magic once and for all. They have a repellant effect on magic, and may also entrap spells completely should they not have enough power.
Destandor have Magic Resistance (3). Also, should a spell directed at Destandor (or a unit he has joined) be dispelled, roll a D6. On a 5+, the wizard forgets that spell and cannot use it for the rest of the game.

Chaos Armour.

Special Rules:
The Will of Chaos
Eye of the Gods
Mark of Khorne

Mage Hunter: Destandors quest is to to hunt down and entrap the magic so hated by his patron god. He Hates all wizards. In addition, as long as he is Frenzied he may not take a leadership test to prevent charging should he have the possibility to charge a wizard or a unit joined by one. Note also that he may not charge another unit instead of the wizard (or its unit) if he are within charging range of more than one.

Rendurok: Rendurok is a Juggernaut with the Devastating Charge special rule. He also has +1 Strength the turn he charges.
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theorox
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Clanlord
Dude. That's pretty cool and probably well-balanced. Looks great! :)

Theo
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Blood-Spattered Angel
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The Chosen
Chaos Lord 210
Mark of Khorne 015
Guillotine 055
Juggernaut 050
MR3 045 375

So 55pts needs to cover: Hatred (Wizards), Juggernaut abilities (Devastating Charge, Brass Horn), Spell Prison ability.

At a guess, Rendurok's abilities would boost his cost up to 70pts. Hatred (Wizard) would probably be 10pts. given it affects Movement (best comparison is a dwarf rune for 15pts., but that book is 2 editions old). That would leave 25pts. for Spell Prison's amnesiac ability, which seems to be in the ballpark. 430pts. is the cost of a tooled up disc mage so I think that this is a good cost for a dedicated mage-killer/unit hammer.
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Destandor
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Jailor of Hated Magic
Very good then. I'll try him out some day and tell you how it went.
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Eta
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Exalted Guardian
Blood-Spattered Angel
Aug 7 2011, 03:08 AM
Chaos Lord 210
Mark of Khorne 015
Guillotine 055
Juggernaut 050
MR3 045 375

So 55pts needs to cover: Hatred (Wizards), Juggernaut abilities (Devastating Charge, Brass Horn), Spell Prison ability.

At a guess, Rendurok's abilities would boost his cost up to 70pts. Hatred (Wizard) would probably be 10pts. given it affects Movement (best comparison is a dwarf rune for 15pts., but that book is 2 editions old). That would leave 25pts. for Spell Prison's amnesiac ability, which seems to be in the ballpark. 430pts. is the cost of a tooled up disc mage so I think that this is a good cost for a dedicated mage-killer/unit hammer.

Don't forget that our current Chaos Lord is heavily overpriced for what you get. I wouldn't pay 430 points for a badly protected character that has Frenzy and a quite high movement value.
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