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| Rumours of WoC update in White Dwarf | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 11 2011, 05:42 AM (1,792 Views) | |
| phierlihy | Aug 15 2011, 10:22 AM Post #31 |
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The Chosen
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Um...the Slaanesh Giant is hands-down the best Giant in the Warhammer universe. |
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| mrtn | Aug 15 2011, 06:14 PM Post #32 |
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Swashbuckling Moderator
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I'll believe it when I see it. |
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| Tome | Aug 15 2011, 08:32 PM Post #33 |
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Seeker of the Winds
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The Spawn can have their uses, and Dragon Ogres are actually a good unit. The Daemon Prince is bad though. Really bad. His stats aren't that bad, but the real thing that makes him terrible is his cost, combined with the fact that you can't give him magic items. |
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| DarkSchneider | Aug 15 2011, 10:15 PM Post #34 |
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Clanlord
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it WAS, back in 7h edition, when hitting first meant no one would hit you back, and when WM were more difficult to use. Now, he will just get blasted to death. In CC, big blocks of infantry will not break due to steadfast, and the great number of attacks will kill him, having no protections. Against monsters, he's got that orrible "bite" attack, so you MUST roll 1-4. He may actually have a use against cavalry, but really, that would be a waste of points. Orcs giant is better, cause it cost less and instead of "Bite" he's got "Headbutt" which is pretty useful. Shaggots and D.Ogres are not so bad, yes, but they really need a huge drop in points.... |
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| rothgar13 | Aug 16 2011, 12:30 AM Post #35 |
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Clanlord
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I don't doubt that the Slaanesh Giant is the best Giant in Warhammer (though the Warpainted-up Orc Giant might have a say in that), but the thing is that even that's not very good. Being the best version of a terrible unit isn't saying much. :) As for the Daemon Prince... I don't know. I'm going to give him a try. MoT means he has a 4+ Ward (which was going to be one of the items you were going to buy for him anyway), he can fly already, and he's a Monster (whooo Thunderstomps!). He is quite expensive points-wise, but I like his ability to bring a bit of everything to the table. |
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| phierlihy | Aug 16 2011, 06:22 AM Post #36 |
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The Chosen
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A Slaanesh Giant may not be a War Hydra or an Abomination but he's not a Cygor either. He has the potential to win the game and he's scary enough to other players that he HAS to be dealt with. Charging in, performing a Yell&Bawl to win combat, is pretty amazing. Not to mention all the Vampire Lords and Slanns they keep picking up. |
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| Atropos | Aug 16 2011, 09:39 AM Post #37 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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IMO, our monsters are very expensive. The Slaanesh Giant is OK, but, I wouldn't bother fielding Giants or Shaggoths when I can field Warshrines and Hellcannons. I mean... a Shaggoth is 265 points (with no upgrades)... you then take a look at a DE Hydra and... oh well... something went wrong. Our book is quite good as it is, IMO, we only need cheaper monsters. |
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| Bitterman | Aug 16 2011, 03:05 PM Post #38 |
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The Chosen
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Yeah, I mean, you compare pretty much anything to the DE Hydra and it doesn't look like good value... it's very undercosted, and that's well known. Interestingly though, the Hydra is the only worthwhile Rare choice for DEs (I'm playing a 5000 point game with my DEs on Sunday and was slightly taken aback to realise how few Rare options they really have... it's just that the one they do have is very, very good). We have far more of our options stuffed in the Rare slot and it's that, actually, that makes the cost of some of our monsters a problem, not a comparison to the Hydra... by the time you've taken a Warshrine and a Hellcannon there's no room for a Shaggoth in 2000 points, and you can't take a dual-Shaggoth list in 2000 either (just like you can take a dual-Hydra list in 2000). So it's not just the direct comparison to the Hydra that makes a Shaggoth a bit pricey - it's also the fact you can't fit two of them in a 2K list. Those kinds of synergies really play about with all our monsters and ultimately we've got too many Rare choices to be convenient. Guess it's lucky we can ignore the Spawn and Scylla - still leaves quite a lot, though. It's also one reason I'm dubious about this Manticore claim (that strangely hasn't been mentioned anywhere else) - another Rare choice of an averagely-good-but-no-better-than-that monster? Thanks, but it's not very useful to us... doesn't give us anything we can't already do. |
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| CyderPyrate | Aug 16 2011, 08:40 PM Post #39 |
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The Chosen
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An enormous mountain of salt needs to be taken with this, I think. The base of the claim seems to be the fact that we got a manticore for SoM. Although there might have been some confusion with the release of the Chaos Banners (which are awesome!) that snuck/sneaked into WD this month. As everyone has already said, it seems very unlikely that we get any more toys any time soon. Especially seeing as we are seen by many (wrongly, I add) that we are an easy, 'buy big blocks, push blocks forward, win' army. |
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| Alexander_Keith | Aug 17 2011, 10:30 PM Post #40 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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So no one can confirm this rumour? |
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| wamphyri101 | Aug 17 2011, 10:42 PM Post #41 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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Give it until the End of the Month. I will try and get info at the ETC as something might come up. If its coiming soon I recon it will be after the Ogre release next month |
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| Ghular | Aug 18 2011, 01:41 AM Post #42 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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The only thing I wish they'd amend are the 2 never used marks. Sure you can use one for marauder horse that nobody ever takes anyway, and the other for one unit of warriors or Knights, but how about making 2 of the Gods not suck totally in comparison to Tzeentch and Khorne. I can live with all the crappy units in the book as long as they just even out the gods so we can see different lists other than ones with Khorne/GW Marauder blocks and Tzeentch Chosen/Warriors/Knights/Marauders/Lords/Sorcerers/Warshrines/etc. It would be lovely if "Warriors of Chaos: Tzeentch with some Khorne and a hellcannon" turned into the the book "Warriors of Chaos". |
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| Bitterman | Aug 18 2011, 04:08 AM Post #43 |
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The Chosen
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Yes... I agree... but... it's not easy, is it? I mean, Khorne is the god of War. Tzeentch is the god of Magic. Warhammer is about... War and Magic. Lust and Disease are always going to feel a little bit forced in, aren't they? Don't get me wrong, I hope they find a way to do it. But if you're looking for effective warriors, you'll go to devotees of the war god; and if you're looking for an effective magic user, you'll go to the devotees of the magic god. The unending struggle between the Chaos gods is balanced by Slaanesh using lust/temptation and Nurgle using despair/disease/entropy, which work great in WFRP but not so much in games of massed battles. So... what I'm saying is... I totally agree that it's boring to see nothing but Khorne and Tzeentch on the Warhammer tabletop, but OTOH I can also understand it. Thoughts on fixes...? Hmm, quick brainstorm: Nurgle to spread Nurgle's Rot (a kind of instakill like Skaven Plague Censer Bearers etc) or instil despair (-1 Ld to enemies within 6" perhaps); Slaanesh to offer the enemy temptation (Ld test each round of combat or can't attack them) or, well, hmm, that's all I've got (the Daemons thing of Slaanesh being really fast for no reason is silly IMO). Just a thought... it's clear that -1WS/BS and immune to fear/terror/panic just isn't good enough. I'd also like to see a return to Marks of Chaos doing different things for different units. I know they took it out for simplicity, but even then they couldn't take it out entirely (a MoT is more useful to a Sorcerer than a Hero, and MoK for Spawn and MoS for Giants needed to be given special exceptions anyway) so they might as well give in and do it properly. Of course... none of this would happen in a WD update... which I suppose makes all of this OT! Sorry. [Edit] Oh - and I'd also like to see a return of a proper division between gods. No more Knights with the MoT but a Khorne-themed banner to make them frenzied... yes, I did that for a while, but I felt dirty so I stopped. Apart from anything else, disallowing such cross-god combos gives meaning to the idea of Chaos Undivided... which could return to being a Mark in its own right. [/Edit] |
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| khorndog | Aug 23 2011, 08:37 AM Post #44 |
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The Chosen
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As far as rules popping up in WD this year as being different or happening more often than in previous years, I think that's a pretty big stretch...besides the terrorgeist and the updated sisters of battle, what else has their been? It should also be mentioned that this has happened many times over the years- I remember when the Blood Angels were only a WD pdf Army List. Also, someone mentioned GW "sneaking" the Deamons update onto the site...all they did was come up with a battalion, and released a new finecast character, which I would hardly call a significant update. Again, I doubt that WoC (or any other army) are going to get a major update in WD anytime soon, but I certainly wouldn't hate it. Just saying, take this with a huge HUGE grain of salt, but I wouldn't hate having new rules/models. |
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