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| Hinge's Ramblings | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 16 2011, 01:26 PM (13,971 Views) | |
| Krakanrock | Apr 26 2012, 03:46 AM Post #181 |
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Exalted Guardian
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Congrats on the Fri & Sun games and the Best Sports award! Bummer about Sat event. More so about the poor sportsmanship from the other players. Sort of disappointing to hear. |
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| Hinge | Apr 26 2012, 06:02 AM Post #182 |
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Exalted Guardian
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Conga lines- With the release of the Empire book, there seems to be a large amount of back and forth on the internet about this formation. For 3 fingers benefit, here is a little run down of Conga Lines. As you suspected, this is a formation that is a single file line. The goal is to minimize the number of attacks coming back. When used with an unbreakable or stubborn unit, this can be an effective way to lock up a unit for a period of time. By minimizing the number of attacks coming in, the unit takes fewer casualties and will take longer to grind through. Putting a unit champ at the head of a conga makes them even more effective. Some common ones: -Flagellants -Greatswords -Reiksguard Knights -Any undead -any demon, even more effective if the stubborn banner is in the army -A unit with a character with the Crown of Command can use this formation -Ironbreakers -unit of slayers -detachments for greatswords. Think about 10 archers. The skirmishing helps mitigate one of the weakness of congas, maneuverability. A primary weakness of the tactic is the maneuverability. While the unit has a short wheel arc, the length of the unit usually swings it around in very wide arcs. Make sure to enforce the one inch rule. Unless it is a particularly small unit, it often requires some form of reform to get into position. Its big flank also presents a weakness. If you have a second unit able to hit the flank, the conga will usually crumple pretty quickly. Finally, a conga is susceptible to being tied up by opposing chaff units. I have had congas used against me a number of times on an ad hoc basis, usually by the 7th ed VC books. Since MSU does not generate a lot of static combat rez, this can be pretty effective. Where people can get bent out of shape are lists designed specifically to use this tactic. A brutal one is a Demonette Conga, Siren Song, stubborn banner. You do not even need to maneuver very well to pull this off. To counter, you need careful use of chaff to not get hammered. Chaff his flamers are probably shredding. I can see how ETC is concerned with Conga Line formations. Often times, a list is designed to take on opposing teams most heinous list build and conserve points in the face of a likely loss. I am not sure requiring two wide will make congas any less effective. It does double the casualties the unit will likely take, but the basic strategy remains. The above demon build would not be handicapped by it much. Most other conga lines would still likely hold up an opposing unit long enough to obtain whatever goal you are trying for. I believe ETC also limits unit sizes, so using a conga line to lock up that one huge uber unit is not as key in that environment. |
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| 3Fingers | Apr 27 2012, 01:15 AM Post #183 |
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Slave
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Great summary, much appreciated. |
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| Deleted User | May 1 2012, 02:10 AM Post #184 |
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Deleted User
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Great read Hinge, you've definitely inspired me to play a bit differently. In fact, I just ordered parts to convert a pair of chariots for my own list. I do wonder though, how do you feel about Dragon Ogres? I was thinking they'd make a great combo with the chariots, or monster hunters. |
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| Hinge | May 1 2012, 02:15 AM Post #185 |
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Exalted Guardian
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I am starting a conversion project, using the mournfang cav as a body, the ogre body, and mino head, all doine as a large centaur. We will see how it turns out. I have never actually played with them. At this point I have a unit from every entry in the army book accept a Shaggoth, DO, and chaos ogres. I want to round out the selection. I may own/play some other armies but WOC is my favorite. |
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| Deleted User | May 1 2012, 03:21 AM Post #186 |
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Deleted User
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Ah okay, be interested to hear your thoughts on them. Personally, I feel like they get a raw deal most of the time, and the existing models don't do them any favors but I can see them being pretty mean. |
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| KellyW | May 6 2012, 02:00 AM Post #187 |
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Slave
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Hinge, Are you on any other Forums? e.g warhammer empire I would like to ask you empire related questions... but this is kind of a WoC thread :P Thanks |
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| Hinge | May 7 2012, 01:02 PM Post #188 |
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Exalted Guardian
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I belong to Warhammer Empire under the same nickname. I do not post much and only check it infrequently. You can always PM me on this forum as well if you want to chat. Hinge |
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| Hinge | May 10 2012, 04:49 AM Post #189 |
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Exalted Guardian
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I just returned from SAWS this last weekend and figured I would ramble a bit about the Northern California Tourney scene. SAWS is a five game, 2,500 point tourney held in Sacramento. I believe it is in its 11th year, making it a pretty long running tourney and draws well from Northern California. 64 players entered this year. It is a heavy comp tourney, having its own comp system (though they allow most SC). Like all such systems, there are those who will figure out how to min-max it and take lists that slip through the system, though in general, it does a good job of keeping mismatches from occurring in the first couple of rounds. I brought my Carno-lord Lizardmen list (so no Batreps on this forum) to defend my title. I do not like to take the same army twice in a row to a tourney. Alas, fell a bit short, coming in second just behind a mate playing WoC! I will post his list in the army list section when I can get a copy. It is a bit different then your “typical” tourney list. In total, the top ten consisted of 2 WoC, 2 Skaven, 1 LM, 1 Empire, and 4 daemons (all four that entered). OK, WoC, LM, and VC were the most numerous armies. I was surprised at how few Dark Elf players there were. They really seem to be on a down ward trend in popularity here. I also think that VC had a rather poor showing given their numbers (highest was 20th). They may be really struggling in coming up with a tourney competitive list. A skaven player was able to pull a perfect battle score btw. Edit I also picked up Second Best Sports and the placing put me the number one Lizardmen player in the US, with every game played with out a Slann! Now that I am proud of. Edited by Hinge, May 10 2012, 04:57 AM.
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| Krakanrock | May 10 2012, 05:33 AM Post #190 |
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Exalted Guardian
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Well done! On both the tourney results and the LM ranking! :rock: |
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| Dekion | Jun 27 2012, 06:51 PM Post #191 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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Hinge why no knights in you page one list? |
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| Hinge | Jun 28 2012, 05:12 AM Post #192 |
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Exalted Guardian
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A Knight unit chimes in at 300 points for 5. I would have to either give up the Chosen or the Troll/chariot. The Chosen has a well defined roll in the list, so I will not give that up. The troll/chariot combo gives me much more flexibility, is just as durable, and actually hits just as hard if not harder then knights. BTW, I have since exchanged the trolls for a second chariot and another unit of dogs. The chariot/trolls can be used to clear chaf units. There is no chaff unit that can stand up to either and dominating the chaff battle is key to my tactics. The loss of either unit does not hurt. I can create multiple threat zones. The chariots represent great burst damage, especially on a narrow front. You can clip with a chariot while another unit takes up most of the frontage get its entire damage output. The knights would have to share frontage with the other unit and some of each would not be able to fight. Finally, more units allow me to engage in a core principal of msu-disguising my intentions. We play a game that allows both players to have near perfect knowledge of where every unit is and what every unit can do. In such an environment, how do we get to flanks or outmaneuver a foe? No competent commander would willingly uncover a point that is vulnerable to him. That’s why so many games turn into grinding matches, leading to people taking larger units to survive this battle of attrition. By having a slew of units that hit hard, supported by those that enhance their combat capability, I can either threaten several points at once hence placing my opponent on the “horns of a dilemma”, or disguise my point of main effort. |
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| Dekion | Jun 28 2012, 08:27 PM Post #193 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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thanks for the insite. I don't own trolls and have only 1 chariot so i normally run 2 5 knight units at 2k. i'll see if i can get another chariot and some trolls as well as some hounds. When i started people talked me out of the hounds and after seeing how you guys use them i am regretting it. |
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| Hinge | Jun 28 2012, 11:53 PM Post #194 |
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Exalted Guardian
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Hounds are well worth the points. If they kill some thing, great, but that is not their real roll. Trolls are tougher to use. I would go with a second chariot first and give that a try. |
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| Dekion | Jun 29 2012, 02:02 AM Post #195 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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Thanks for the suggestion |
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