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| Marauder Horsemen OR Warhounds ? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 7 2013, 02:07 AM (703 Views) | |
| hasufin | Jun 7 2013, 02:07 AM Post #1 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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Hello folks, I have 45 points left to spend on my army and I don't have any warhounds. I do have 10 Horsemen that I plan to use to deal with redirectors. Should I spend the extra points on more Horsemen or should I include some Warhounds in the army? I prefer Horsemen since they do have a better armor save and range weapons. My fear is that against HE's any Warhounds will be erased by shooting before they can do anything useful. |
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| H4d35 | Jun 7 2013, 02:27 AM Post #2 |
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The Chosen
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By doing anything useful do you mean get shot at before the good stuff in the army gets shot at? Coz that's something useful! Dogs are there to die sadly. However they do it at the expense of something else of yours being attacked which is good news! Horsemen are good fun sometimes but you might be better off creating more targets for the enemy with hounds? What do you think? |
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| hasufin | Jun 7 2013, 02:43 AM Post #3 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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My other units (beside the 10 Horsemen) are 24 warriors w/ MoN, 8 Knights w/ MoT and Blasted Stnd., and 8 Trolls. If I take Warhounds they wont be much use as a screen vs. shooting since I was planning on using the knights and trolls as a screen. I was considering using the extra points for 2 more Horsemen or another Troll or more warriors. The only use I can see for the Warhounds is to chase off redirectors, but since I don't have any frenzy units I don't think that would be an issue. |
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| Godless-Mimicry | Jun 7 2013, 05:11 AM Post #4 |
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No' 9
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When you say a better save and ranged weapons, you are talking about 6+ armour and 6" throwing weapons; both are pretty much negligible. As in either case the unit's purpose is to be chaff and die, the cheaper unit is the best choice. |
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| Khornefed | Jun 7 2013, 07:15 AM Post #5 |
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Exalted Guardian
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I for one like Marauder cav AND dogs. Both in the same list. BTW Godless, Marauder cav with shields are a 5+ AS. Not that it makes any significant difference. Ive been running 2 vanguard dog units with two units of Khorne spear/Axe/Shield maruder cav. The synergy is EXCELLENT. Depending on deployement options, I either vanguard one or the other, sometimes both. Ususally the cav though, all the way out to a flank, then get on the flank and throw at chaff, but be ready for charge next turn, while the dogs are doing their usual redirect moves. I have not had anyone feel they could ignore the cav, which can totally lock down a flank. The option to charge in turn 1 and clear chaff with loads of st 4 attacks is gruesome for the target chaff owner as well. The cav are a deployment phase weapon. Dont expect them to be shock troops, and they will serve you well. |
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| Ashicus79 | Jun 7 2013, 07:35 AM Post #6 |
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Seducer
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I usually run my dogs AND marauders. The fast cav rule works reat for forcing failed charges and the dogs are great throw away units. If you give them poison, they can also be a great threat for warmachines and those solo unbreakable things too. |
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| Asvaldir | Jun 7 2013, 07:46 AM Post #7 |
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Chosen of Tzeentch
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I would say hounds and horsemen fill different roles so it shouldn't be a question of either or. Hounds are great redirectors and cannon fodders as they are cheap enough for you to not care about them dying with pretty fast movement. Marauder horsemen are a bit too pricey to just be throwing out to die to shooting so don't really fill that same cannon fodder role but they are slightly better redirectors as fast cav is a big bonus. Plus with flails they can kill chaff. I'd say with 45pts, definantly hounds. Horsemen are nice but I think hounds are more important and being cheaper are usually the better choice. That being said it's nice to have both. |
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| hasufin | Jun 7 2013, 08:07 AM Post #8 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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This is vs. HE's so if I put the warhounds out front whats stopping the HE's from shooting up a unit of warhounds 1st turn before they can get into CC ? The Horsemen can have a 4+ save and a 12" ST 3 shooting or as stated above they could be vanguard w/ a ST 4 6" shooting. I get the point of using warhounds just to die to draw shooting so they don't reach any warmachine crews , but a unit of horsemen with a 4+ save and the MoS could do that w/o being wiped out, that along with the Fleshy Abundance spell could make it a very durable unit vs. shooting and CC. I still feel though 2 or 3 more horsemen added to a unit with the MoS is better than a throw away unit. |
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| Asvaldir | Jun 7 2013, 09:00 AM Post #9 |
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Chosen of Tzeentch
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If you give marauder horsemen a +4 save they lose their greatest asset: fast cav so I would never give them a +4. Also a +4 AS is not going to save them from say 10 or so shots hitting and wounding. Sure they have 12" s3 shooting. You'll move to get into range, probably be at long range, say have a unit of 5 which means you have shots hitting on 6s, maybe one hit. Not at all useful. Without a doubt I'd say another unit of hounds. Throw them towards the archers or block their LoS and you save your more important units from being shot. |
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| hasufin | Jun 7 2013, 09:19 AM Post #10 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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But can warhounds block LoS for a unit of Horsemen , the Horsemen sit to high don't they ? I can see keeping fast cav for the vanguarding , but then that leaves the warhounds behind the Horsemen unless you pay more points for the warhounds to vanguard and then deploy your Horsemen behind the warhounds which some what defeats the purpose of fast cav/vaguarding since you wont be able to deploy the Horsemen fully out since they would be behind the warhounds. In the army I'm using I'll have 3 fast moving units , Horsemen , Knights and Trolls. Against HE's my opponent will have to spread his shooting 1st turn , if I have the Horsemen at 4+ save with MoS and a possible Fleshy Abundance 5+ regen roll , then a single large unit of 10 or more with ST3 shooting would be a real threat to HE's warmachine crews with T3 and light armor. |
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| Meatgrinder | Jun 7 2013, 10:37 AM Post #11 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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I hate hounds. I take them because I have the models and they are pretty cheap. But they are also pretty useless as anything other than redirects. They die to pretty much anything, even other chaff a lot of the time. Theyre piss weak, but you get what you pay for I suppose. 40 points is pretty cheap. Problem is, theyre not fast cavalry. However, Horsemen strike me as better. 95 points gets you 5 with a musician, javelins and flails. Theyre over twice the price, but theyre fast cav, significantly better at killing other chaff, have a 6+ save, s5 in the first round, and can vanguard up and javelin lone wizards or chaff. Im going to be replacing my hounds with them as soon as I can get the models |
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| hasufin | Jun 7 2013, 10:43 AM Post #12 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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I would spend the extra point per and take shields for the 5+ save still keep fast cav , and if you use lore of nurgle you can cast curse of the leper for +D3 T and/or fleshy abundance for a 5+ regen. do this and you make them worth every point. This seems like Chaos best option for killing shooters and crews. |
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| Ero-Senin | Jun 7 2013, 07:28 PM Post #13 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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They are for different roles. Hounds are there to be an extra target for shooting (a waste for your opponant), as very cheap redirecters and as extra deployment drops. They are excellent for all these roles as they are 30pts for 5, they are not meant to survive. Marauder horsemen are for harrassing with missle fire (throwing axes etc) and fleeing from charges then rallying automatically because of fast cav rule. This pulls units out of place and allows you to make charges/flank charges. Edited by Ero-Senin, Jun 7 2013, 07:29 PM.
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| guardian angel | Jun 7 2013, 08:21 PM Post #14 |
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Exalted Guardian
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Umm, they don't rally automatically, you still have to roll to rally them, hence why a musician is essential! |
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| hasufin | Jun 7 2013, 10:00 PM Post #15 |
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Warrior of the Chamber
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I understand your point but keep in mind "fleeing" isn't always successful either. In a MoS army with a Slaanesh sorcerer or 2 , the tactics of fleeing , harassing , and redirecting would have better chance of succeeding. I'm thinking in a heavy nurgle army that more direct battle tactics will be more successful. |
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