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New to Warriors of Chaos and need help with list; I have what I think is a competitive army but would like any suggestions
Topic Started: Jun 8 2013, 05:26 AM (305 Views)
thughes0801
The Chosen
This is a 3k list that I have been working on. My concept and play style is that I enjoy building incredibly hard to kill units that outlast my opponent and can survive their dirty tricks. Any and all suggestions would be appreciated... Thanks

Lord Choices:
Chaos Lord with Mark of Nurgle, Shield, Scaled Skin, Soul Feeder, Glittering Scales, Sword of Striking and Talisman of Preservation.
Tactics: have in my unit of Nurgle warriors to challenge out anything that the unit champion can not handle and with the best that he could ever be hit on a 5+ combined with a 1+/ 4+ + saves he should be almost impossible to kill. Plus he if I am right he should be able to roll 6 dice for the skull and thanks to the familiar channel on fives which is statistically amazing for channeling purposes.

Total points: 340

Chaos Sorcerer Lord with Mark of Tzeentch, Level 4, Lore of Metal, Chaos Familiar, Third Eye of Tzeentch, Armour of Destiny, and Skull of Katam
Tactics: Using the Metal buffs and debuffs to maximum benefit the tactics would be to place him in a unit of Chaos Warriors that are Mark of Tzeentch and have him function in a similar manner as the Chaos Lord albeit without causing nearly as many wounds in the strike back in return.

Total Points: 385

Grand Total for Lords: 725


Hero Choices:
Chaos Sorcerer with No Mark, Level 2, Lore of Shadow, Dispel Scroll, Enchanted Shield, and Obsidian Trinket
Tactics: Also, placed in the unit of Tzeentch Warriors this is my scroll caddy, along with having the signature of shadow, a 2+ save, and gives my Tzeentch Warriors MR2 to increase their survivability even more.

Total Points: 190


Exalted Hero with BSB, Mark of Tzeentch,Ironcurse Icon, Shield, and the Talisman of Endurance.
Tactics: My BSB will have fairly decent saves at least in comparison to most other armies at a 2+/ 4++ and will be placed in the unit of Tzeentch Warriors to maximize his effectiveness and will give them a 5++ against war machines.

Total Points: 183

Total Points for Heroes: 373


Core Choices:
23 Chaos Warriors running 6x4 with the Chaos Lord and Mark of Nurgle, Full Command, Standard of Discipline, and Shields
Tactics: This unit will have the Chaos Lord in it and the thought process is that it can become both a hammer and an anvil according to what I need it to do.

Total Points: 426

21 Chaos Warriors running 5x4 with the three characters and 4 left in the last row, Mark of Tzeentch, Full Command, Banner of Eternal Flame, and Shields.
Tactics: Tried to make the ultimate anvil unit that will eventually grind down almost anything that it comes into contact with.

Total Points: 387

Total Points for Core: 813

Special:
Chaos Warshrine with Mark of Tzeentch
Tactics: This thing does what it does and I just tried to make it harder to kill. I plan on running it with an entourage for protection as well as the potential to do something potentially incredible in the multiple Daemon Princes.

Total Points: 135

10x Chosen 3 times two of these groups having Mark of Tzeentch, Champion, and Shields, and one of these groups having Mark of Nurgle, Champion, Halberds and Shields.
Tactics: The thought process here is that at the start of the game I can get 4d6 dice on all three of these and every turn thereafter by throwing dice at the bound spell. Chosen may not be that much different to begin with the regular Warriors but a single Toughness boost can change that drastically let alone if you actually get a Daemon Prince and with the ability to use the multiple dice the spawn result will never happen statistically speaking because you would have to roll 4 ones. I know it is possible but highly unlikely. Also, I can use this spell late in the phase after the opponent has sucked up dice trying to stop the shadow and metal spells from going off because those can swing the tide of battle.

Total Points: 720

Total Points for Special: 855

Rare:

3x Skullcrushers of Khorne with Ensorcelled Weapons
Tactics: Do what Skullcrushers do best and act as a hammer and anvil at the same time.

Total Points: 234

Total Points for Rare: 234


Grand Total for the Army 3000/3000 Points

Alrighty that is it please post whatever you can think of to help make this list even harder to kill and still be legal. The point of course is not to take anything that is absolutely unkillable if that means other parts of the army suffer for it. I would rather have be forcing the opponent into a highly difficult war of attrition thanks to my ARMY being hard to kill than hoping to rely on special tricks or favorable matchups. Thanks and I really appreciate it.


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Vissah
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Self-Proclaimed Gangster of the Realm of Chaos
You got a lot of points into characters and I would drop the Chosen en take more Warriors they are basicly the same for lesser points.
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thughes0801
The Chosen
I thought about doing that but in the few games I havr played that 4d6 at the start of the game and beimg able to throw six dice at the shrine basically insured that even without daemon prince transformations if I take that unit up to toughness five and have the champion at toughness six or seven then they have accomplished what I was after because that means on say the mark of nurgle chosen now standard rank and file troops are hitting on fives and wounding on sixes. Thisagain comes from a newb but I have jad success so far with the entourage. ththat's a good thought though and I will tinker with it thanks.
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Asvaldir
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Chosen of Tzeentch
I'm not so sure how well your philosiphy will work. Our army is made for fast heavy hitters and does have the option to make plenty of rock solid anvil units but you need both. You can't win a game in 6 turns just by outlasting your opponent. You need to do damage as well.

I would modify your idea to one of my favorite tactics and one I often use: hammer and anvil. Take a solid core of warriors with shields as anvils and take a variety of heavy hitters to charge in from the flanks and finish off the enemy once they are pinned down by the warriors.

I must say despite the sucess you have had with chosen I really, really encourage you to drop them. They are just too expensive and 10 are not going to do much for you. It's a lot of points to spend on a potential deamon prince when you could be getting a few of our best heavy hitters for that many points. 720 is enough for 2 gorebeasts and a chimera plus more.

Also you could use more speed and that comes with heavy hitters. Skullcrushers are good but not enough on their own and without warhounds they will be easily bated by chaff.

So I'd drop the warshrine which will just take away PD from your sorcs and the chosen, giving you plenty of pts for a chimera or 2, 2 gorebeast chariots and 10-20 hounds.
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thughes0801
The Chosen
Thanks I will definitely try to take them out and see if I can pick more hammers for my list. I was definitely worried about that because without enough hammers I can't win a war of attrition cause I won't have enough offense to inflict the wounds needed to win the combat. I haven't used the gorebeast chariots yet because they seemed really expensive point wise to me. I like the chimeras but they seemed like decently statted glass cannons anc was worried that anything with flaming, which seems like a lot in 8th, would cut it apart. Thankd again for the advice.
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Vissah
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Self-Proclaimed Gangster of the Realm of Chaos
Points wise the Gorebeast is the best priced we probably got :-D
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thughes0801
The Chosen
Very cool I will definitely relook at them and see how they come out does anyone have any other suggestions, I have to admit I was thinking about nixing the shadow mage to throw more points around but love miasmia and believe I need a scroll, would love to hear thoughts on this and anything anyone wants to suggest.
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Asvaldir
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Chosen of Tzeentch
thughes0801
Jun 9 2013, 02:35 AM
I was definitely worried about that because without enough hammers I can't win a war of attrition cause I won't have enough offense to inflict the wounds needed to win the combat.
Right on point.

Gorebeast are actually if anything underpriced. 130pts for T6 5 wounds is a bargin, not to mention 7 s5 ws5 attacks. Give it MoN and it's even better.

You do have a point with the chimera being a bit of a glass cannon. T5 4 wounds is not great for a monster but regen and fly make him ok. As long as you are not up against flaming cannonballs you should be fine. I'd just make sure to not charge him right into the front of an infantry block without support like any monster. With 7-9 s6 attacks he is a great combat support monster for your warrior blocks.

I'd keep the shadow mage. Lore of shadow is sweet and you can't go wrong with miasma and you certainly could use the scroll. I don't think you even need to drop him as if you drop the chosen and warshrine you have all the pts you need to take chariots and chimeras for your hammers.

If you want to use something else in addition to chariots and chimeras I'd look at a shaggoth, trolls and/or ogres. Shaggoth is not as good as many other units but it's still decent and ws6 on a monster is nice. Can't go wrong with trolls as they have regen, s5 and their vomit attack is very handy against knights with good armor. I have never used ogres but with GWs I think they have potential.
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thughes0801
The Chosen
I appreciate the comments thanks. I will look into all of that seriously. I probably will stay away from the ogres at least for the time being because my normal army that I have been playing and collecting is ogre kingdoms. I came over to warriors to try something new lol, but I am definitely not discounting them at all just putting them on the back burner and I am very curious about trolls as well they just seem really high powered with the vomit attack. I have now dropped the chosen entourage and warshrine combo and added in two chimeras with regen and breath weapon and two gorebeasts chariots with mark of nurgle. How does the list look to everyone now and does anyone else see anyrhing that needs to be changed.
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thughes0801
The Chosen
Also by the way why does nobody seem to like the slaughterbrute unbound I agree he's a pain but if you bound him to the hortense build he would never be unbound and I can't think of anyplace that it says there can't be more than one slaughterrute bound to the same lord. Then if you took two of them with extra claws and bound them to a hortense build and added two chimeras kitted with chimeras with regen and breath weapon in a tower formation be unleashed for som truly multicharging carnage. Can someone explain to me what I'm missing with that high a weapon skill at that many attacks and strength they seem like a pretty good hammer to me
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Asamu
The Chosen
That lord is at a 3+/4+, not a 1+. Glittering scales is light armor, which overrides the Chaos armor you would normally have, reducing the armor save by 2 points.

The list is decent, but it lacks significant hitting power outside of the Skullcrushers, and it is slow. Vs an army like High elves with a large block of White Lions, you would really struggle.

The units of 10 chosen are incredibly risky. Your chance of generating a DP will average to about 30% per game, with the warshrine going off every turn, and being chosen doesn't help significantly with that. Running that as one unit, dropping a few models, and adding in warhounds to slow down your opponent and harass their warmachines would be a good option.
Mobility, or control of mobility is huge for combat focused lists such as the WoC army. Taking lots of warhounds and/or chariots, skullcrushers, and flying nearly unkillable lords/DPS are the typical solutions to this problem.


Quote:
 
Also by the way why does nobody seem to like the slaughterbrute unbound I agree he's a pain but if you bound him to the hortense build he would never be unbound and I can't think of anyplace that it says there can't be more than one slaughterrute bound to the same lord. Then if you took two of them with extra claws and bound them to a hortense build and added two chimeras kitted with chimeras with regen and breath weapon in a tower formation be unleashed for som truly multicharging carnage. Can someone explain to me what I'm missing with that high a weapon skill at that many attacks and strength they seem like a pretty good hammer to me


T5 with weak armor and less than 6 wounds. In addition, most units will still be hitting it on 4s when it is bound, and with so many units having at least strength 4, it's not going to last long.
Also, it only has 4 attacks at strength 7, and you pay 20 points for 2 more at strength 5. It's decent vs other monsters, and low WS strength 3 units, but it just doesn't last long enough against most of the units in the game, and it's movement isn't high enough to reliably get charges.
The shaggoth has only slightly lower weapon skill, but it can have 5 strength 8 attacks with ASL, or 6 strength 6 attacks at I4. With I4, the Shaggoth actually hits before most other units, giving it the chance to do some damage before taking any, it has move 7, so it is more likely to get charges, and it has an extra wound over the slaughterbrute, making it less vulnerable to cannons. In addition, it doesn't lose it's effectiveness if the general dies.

Better than either of these Rare options are the skullcrushers, hellcannon, and even spawn.
Edited by Asamu, Jun 12 2013, 10:34 AM.
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thughes0801
The Chosen
Awesome,thanks for the breakdown on this. I had not thought about the slughterbrute in that regard I can definitely see now why everyone is so down on it. I will make sure not to add one of these things lol. I appreciate the comments.
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