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| Suggestions/Advice for beginning writers | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 15 2012, 09:36 PM (764 Views) | |
| skywatcher | Jul 15 2012, 09:36 PM Post #1 |
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Hi, I'm a relatively new fan , just started watching in season 3, but I caught up on Seasons 1 and 2 with a couple long flights. As a brief bit of background, some friends of mine work in what is politely described as a hardship region. Things can be repressive and volatile at best, but they try to promote literacy and civil society both of which are sadly lacking among other things. Social media isn't allowed, most people aren't permitted to own or have little access to computers and electricity if present can be sporadic. There is limited mobile, but it's monitored and there are other considerations. They do hold small meetings and one of the methods used is to play clips of RB and other shows and encourage the kids to write as both a way to improve skills and as an outlet for the pervasive fear and hopelessness. We are all numbers people and not great with letters, so we thought we would ask for any suggestions that might help these early writers. Most are middle school age and have only received a few months of formal schooling if any, but some are very bright and persistent in spite of familial and cultural pressures. Due to safety concerns, I'm not writing more on a public forum, but hope that provides a bit of background. We've all been beginners at something; we'd be grateful for any suggestions/advice from some more experienced writers. 1) Suggestions/Tips How did you begin to write? Do you discuss ideas with others? If so, what weight do you give to their input? How do you come up with your ideas? Do you work with an outline? Any help is greatly appreciated. If you can think of anything else, please feel free to share. 2) Reviews etc. They tried to upload for one of the kids and encountered some difficulties. While not Pulitzer material to say that "you'd rather drink diarrhea than read this" and similar comments seems a bit harsh to write to a young teen. Is this the norm for this fandom or was that just a troll? Basically, I guess what I'm asking is if I need to create an alternative site. 3) Other While any advice gathered would be passed on to these beginning writers, everyone is free to add input. Other new or aspiring writers may find any tips helpful as well. Thank you. Skywatcher To moderators: I believe this adheres to forum guidelines, but if it doesn't, please feel free to delete. |
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| Cythy | Jul 15 2012, 09:49 PM Post #2 |
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I think this is fine (if LAwoman or Kiren disagree then they'll delete it) To answer your questions: 1) I think every writer is different and the kids should realize that they need to find their own niche. Personally, I write based on experience, or what grabs me. I find that I normally don't like to talk to anyone about it but sometimes I will talk out loud. I also find that 'getting into the head of the character' and playing the scene out in my head helps. As for an outline, goes back to my first part about how everyone is different. I hate outlines and always wrote my papers and then wrote the outlines when we had to submit a paper with an outline. Some of my friends are the exact opposite, they always made outlines, even when it was not required. 2) I'm assuming that they uploaded to ff.net - not a wise idea, especially if the writing is not amazing. Your best bet would either be live journal or a blog and to ask other friends who are willing to critique and praise appropriately until the writer improves to a level where they will not get the nasty comments. Fanfiction can have young writers to senior citizens, both reading and reviewing - and some people are harsh. I would create an alternative site. 3) Other advice - you win some and you lose some. Sometimes you write something that you think is amazing and other people don't and other times you write something and debate with yourself for hours/days whether or not to post and everyone loves. As a writer, YOU are the one that matters and if you are proud of it, that is what matters. |
![]() Catch you on the flip side Check me out: ff.net ; livejournal | |
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| margie311 | Jul 15 2012, 10:01 PM Post #3 |
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I have a feeling that my reply will largely overlap with Cythy's but I'll go ahead anyway. 1. It is doubly hard to write about something that doesn't interest you. Every writing teacher will say "write what you know," that is, write from experience. But, if there's a topic that interests you, don't be afraid to sit down and do whatever research necessary. This includes anything from Google to the encyclopedia to interviewing people/experts in the field if you have access to them. Personally, I love to bounce ideas off of people, because everyone experiences a single act differently. Not everyone tastes the same thing when they eat an orange, for instance. So getting input from other writers/readers is definitely helpful to make sense of a complex situation. As for process... I start with an idea, or a picture. In the Distance, I started with a concept - Running. In the Witness, I had a picture of a very specific scene in my head. And then I expand from there; I build the story around the idea/picture. I develop a very ROUGH outline, what I want to happen, relationships/conflict, etc... and then I start writing. And I start with the good stuff; the fun stuff. If I start on the more procedural end of things, I tend to get bogged down, and basically quit before I even get to the fun stuff. My outline is constantly evolving, but I'm always moving in one general direction. 2. Some people like to tear writers down whether they are beginners or not. If your goal is to encourage young writers, it would be beneficial to start them posting on a forum that is there only for constructive criticism/assistance. Also, and this is possibly a little sad, but one of the best talents/traits a writer can develop is a thick skin. No one's writing is going to be loved by everyone. It's just the truth. And some critics are bound to be a little more raw with their reviews. Making sure the writer is happy with their own work is imperative and probably the number 1 most important thing. (That being said, if anyone is 100% happy with their work, I think they probably need to change things up. Never stop growing as a writer. And you can only grow when you try new things/styles/genres/etc.) 3. This is something I've been struggling with lately, but sometimes, the words just don't come to you. Sometimes you can sit in front of the computer, or on the couch with a pad of paper, and you can't get a single sentence out about whatever topic you're aiming to write about. My advice? Write anyway. Write about your day, about your family, about your plans for the weekend. Just the simple act of putting words onto paper (or Word) will stimulate your brain and your creative thought processes, and might open you up to new ideas/plots/etc. Hope that's helpful. :) Edited by margie311, Jul 15 2012, 10:08 PM.
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| StarryDreamer | Jul 15 2012, 11:04 PM Post #4 |
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Celery Stalker
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1. I generally don't bounce ideas off of people. Usually an idea or story pops into my head and I have it get it on paper. I'm different than a lot of other fanfic writers in that I always write out my whole story before I post anything. this way I know exactly what I want to happen and if I change anything later on I can easily go back and alter an earlier chapter. I find it's best to publish on a regular schedule because the readers like a quick update. I also tend to write more one shots... But thats just me. 2. I've written for the fandoms of RB, the Office, Bones and Smallville. Honestly the RB reviews are the most eloquent and supportive that I've ever received. In fact when I posted my first RB story I was so surprised by the sheer quantity and quality of reviews that I told a coworker about this fandom and I never talk fandom with my real life friends lol. I agree with others that ff.net is really really harsh if you don't tow the party line--- meaning that perfect grammar and style is expected otherwise they'll delete on whim. Posting on livejournal or a fandom site is much better. 3. I always think that you should write what you know. I agree that it's helpful to get into the head of the character. Sometimes I get so depressed when I'm trying to write angst because I want to feel what they're going through. When I wrote my Bones fic, I had to try and go to a super dark place to do so. When I wrote one of my Office fics I listened to old Italian songs by Sinatra and Martin as the story was set in Rometo get into the feeling. I think it's great that the parents are encouraging them to write fanfic. When I was in high school (long before Internet was a viable option) I used to write fanfic to get over summer hiatuses for tv shows. When I worked a boring factory job I'd fanfic the next episode of my soaps in my head. I think it's really great andante helps young writers develop. |
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| Cythy | Jul 15 2012, 11:07 PM Post #5 |
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I just wanted to add one thing to Margie's # 3 - sometimes when you can't write, start another story. Many of my one-shots so far this season have all come about when I was trying to work on my multichapter story. When I got frustrated, I started writing something new - same fandom. I find it really works for me. |
![]() Catch you on the flip side Check me out: ff.net ; livejournal | |
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| Natalie | Jul 15 2012, 11:24 PM Post #6 |
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trust these writers skywatcher...they are amazing. |
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| LAwoman | Jul 15 2012, 11:44 PM Post #7 |
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You got some great advice from really great authors already. I'd just add that other than trolls, who will rip anyone just for the thrill of it, it might help to put a little context about the author's age/skill level in the author's notes. That might change the reviews from mentioning grammar and syntax errors to focusing on constructive feedback about imagination and overall coherence, etc. |
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| Cythy | Jul 16 2012, 12:03 AM Post #8 |
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Going on what LAwoman said - depending on how well they write - you might want to think about beta writers for them. Some beta readers will tear stories apart, other beta readers will just critique by fixing grammar and syntax errors and pointing out sentences that don't make sense. What I would do is have your friends (or yourself) "test" these beta readers to see their reactions. I've been a beta reader and I've had people beta for me - beta readers who care about making the writers better writers will really go the distance (if they have time) and will really be able to help these young writers |
![]() Catch you on the flip side Check me out: ff.net ; livejournal | |
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| StarryDreamer | Jul 16 2012, 12:09 AM Post #9 |
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Celery Stalker
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Since you're dealing with kids and developing their writing skills, presumably they don't really have context to a lot of the scenes since they may not have even watched the episode. What if you showed them a particular scene-- like say Andy running into Sam at the Alpine Bar-- and then cut it off at a cliffhanger point, like right before it went to commercial when Andy & Traci look over and see Sam and he gives that *look*. Stop it there and then have them finish the scene. What do they think will happen next? You could even break it down by character-- ie. Kid 1-- write from Sam's perspective. What is going on in his mind, what will he do next. Kid 2-- write from Jaime's perspective. What is going on in his mind, what will he do next. etc. I remember when I was in elementary school the teacher would give us prompts like "It was a dark and stormy night..." and then we had to write a story from there. Doing an exercise with scenes from a variety of TV shows should also assist with written development. You could do dramatic scenes, comedic scenes, etc. You could even have them write in script style and perform it. |
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| margie311 | Jul 16 2012, 12:09 AM Post #10 |
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I agree. Finding someone you trust, with the knowledge/skill to edit and make suggestions is so incredibly beneficial. Once you find a good editor/beta, don't let them go without a fight ;) |
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| srsn | Jul 16 2012, 02:17 AM Post #11 |
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1. I began to write, or to enjoy writing, in high school, due to an awesome teacher in our Norwegian class, who pretty much let us be really creative and imaginative, and really recognized those who put an effort into their work. Later, I started reading BTVS fanfiction, and gave a shot at writing one myself. Then, when Rookie Blue came along, I was so frustrated by everything that was going on on the show, that I just had to get it out in some way, resulting in my stories. I usually suck at coming up with ideas, but I love being challenged. Due to this, a lot of my longer stories are written based on challenges/ideas from other people. Most of my one-shots, though, are mostly based on a sudden glimpse of a scene in my head. When I first started writing RB fanfics, I didn't really discuss my ideas with others, but as time progressed, and I got more difficult challenges/ideas/concepts to work with, I started getting stuck a lot, and therefore began asking others what they thought and such. When I'm discussing ideas with someone, I take all of their suggestions into consideration, but ultimately I decide what goes or not (I'm really adamant that the story has to sound like me, and is something that I agree with. So, if I'm given an idea that I feel is wrong, it doesn't make the cut.) I have only used an outline for two of my stories, one (Can't Let Go) because it was quite complicated, keeping track of time, what should happen at what point in time, etc. , and the other (For You, I Would) because there was a lot of stuff I needed to put into it. Otherwise I just let things flow, and write the scenes as I see and hear them in my brain. Meaning I usually start at the beginning and end up at the end. Sometimes, during this process, my whole idea and concept changes, and the story ends up being quite different from what I first imagined. For example: For the first chapter of my story "A Night Spent Watching TV", I woke up one morning, with Andy's voice in my head thinking these lines: It's not like she really meant what she said when the words left her mouth. It had been more of a joke really. A kind of; hey, I can be funny too. She had no idea he would take it like this. So seriously. And that turned into the start of the story. When I started writing, I figured that I'd give writing in present tense a shot, something I hadn't done too much before then, but, now, have come to really enjoy. As I was writing, I found myself wondering how Sam's pov would be like, and, since I generally prefer just writing from one person's pov, the one-shot series ended up like it is now, with two-part dual pov thing going on. 2. I can only think of a single review I have gotten in this fandom that was what I could call negative, but it really just amused me. I do know that a lot of people have struggled with harsh reviews over on ffnet. I am a strong believer that if you don't like it, either give a suggestion to how it can be improved, or just don't say anything. I'm sad that some people don't seem to think like this, but instead feels the need to belittle other people's hard work. I don't know how it is on the other sites, as I don't frequent them that often. 3. In my opinion, I do my best writing when I am frustrated with something, then again, I do use my writing as a sort of therapy, and I learn a lot about myself through what I write. When I was just starting out, I found it easier to just write what I knew. I've got, I don't even know how many, stories about people like me, doing things I would have liked to do, just to see how I think I would have reacted in a certain situation. But as I developed as a writer I have come to enjoy challenging myself in my writing - thinking up wild scenarios, changing up the style, the tone, doing more research, etc. But most of all, my biggest advice when starting out, is just to play around with it and have fun. Edited by srsn, Jul 16 2012, 02:21 AM.
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![]() My fanfic-site: http://srsnfiction.blog.com/ Misc RB images and edits by me:http://s1201.photobucket.com/albums/bb356/srsnielsen/RB/ | |
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| skywatcher | Jul 17 2012, 03:04 PM Post #12 |
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1) Thanks Thanks to everyone who responded, I appreciate your taking the time. There are some excellent suggestions and I'll pass them on next time I'm able to speak with my friends. We all have a lot of admiration for these kids and what they've been through. If we can help provide an outlet, we're going to make the best one possible. A special thank you to all writers who shared their personal experiences and works. I'm relatively new to this fandom, but my e-reader is now ready for my next long trip. 2) Features Since everyone has been so responsive, and the majority seem to advise against fanfiction for beginning writers, I wonder if I could impose once again and ask about your experiences with journal accounts. At this time, I'm leaning toward setting up a separate site for multiple reasons, but was curious about your interactions with various providers. a) What independent sites do you use if you use a journal site? What are the language capabilities for non-English speakers? Are there geopolitical issues? Are there age restrictions on writers? b) If you were to set up an independent site, what features would be the most basic needed? What things would you like, but are not essential? Thank you again for your time and suggestions. |
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| Cythy | Jul 17 2012, 04:57 PM Post #13 |
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I would set up a separate site - and I think you should also look into student sites. I took a technology course for my major (education) and my professor touched on the subject but didn't have a lot of knowledge. There are sites out there that are geared for students to post and for other students to provide feedback. Honestly, even sites like livejournal can get nasty reviews - your best bet is probably either to create your own website for them or to look into the 'student friendly' websites that I mentioned. |
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| stenogirl | Aug 18 2012, 05:13 PM Post #14 |
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Okay, so I wasn't sure where to post this, but I thought all of the writers of Rookie Blue Fanfiction would really get a kick out of this writing advice, and the angst of a fellow author who is struggling with the process of his own writing. I haven't read anything by this author, but I have heard that he is excellent, and best selling. Also, a slight disclaimer-- there are a few very colorful (and disturbing) metaphors and offensive words, so you are warned!!! (But not a lot, so if you can skip over it-- it's worth it!) http://www.patrickrothfuss.com/blog/2009/02/concerning-release-of-book-two.html P.S. I completely sympathize with you all who keep getting hounded for updates constantly, when you are writing for fun, and not for profit, and you all have real jobs and real lives as well. Just know that we appreciate you all and love reading your stories, which is why we ask about the updates!
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